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Thank you

No problem. :)

I have discovered a bug with per pixel painting.

When I have symmetry turned off, it's still active across the X axis. This is without having activated symmetry in the first place. Build80.

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I think Phil mentioned this earlier, the "safe frame" box renders.There should be an option to tun this off.(see image)

I have quite a few new works I rendered turntable movies of, but would like to redo them using the new gradient background,but that box is rendering.

Can the 3d grid disappear as well when rendering like it use to.

I am also having problems sculpting files saved in alpha 60.These files contain multiple sub objects.If you want I can send you a .3b file.

Nice crocodile tail! :good:

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A bug that Phil mentioned quite a number of times still exists.

The bug with the difference in size of brush between a 3D viewport and the 2D UV texture viewport is still substantial.

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Thank you very much Andrew for implementing mouse-customizations!

This is going to be very helpful.

Some first comments:

As these customizations do not only have to do with camera manipulation

they maybe instead should be placed inside the options-panel.

With the new mouse-mapping options it is also possible to create ambiguous

stuff.

In order to mimic the Rhino navigation I put camera rotation on RMB.

As it is necessary to be able at any time I made this functionality also active

when over the object. However: Quite a few other commands need RMB as well

(hardcoded), especially in Retopo-Commands (add points&faces, tweak etc.).

To solve problems like these Mouse Button actions might be classified

as following:

Click/Doubleclick (without draging)

Click/Doubleclick (without draging) + Hotkeys

Drag outside/over object without having objects selected

Drag with object selection (curve points, mesh vertices etc.) The selected objects should highlight.

Holger

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Andrew

Unfortunately the last 3 alphas have been unuseable for me.

The same problem with the interface persists - displaced and flashing on and off toolbars and menus on startup which cannot be fixed and I have to close the program.

This problem started with alpha 78 - versions up to 77 were okay.

Regards

Mal

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Nice crocodile tail! :good:

Ah, you figured that one out.Hope to post the rest soon. :)

I'm having problems with rendering refract shader in latest alpha.It renders invisible.

post-913-1241230730_thumb.jpg

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I found the way actually. In the Camera > Custom Navigation panel, scroll all the way down to the bottom and uncheck the box "Display Navi Zone".

Thanks Phil, that's great.I really need to spend more time with these latest alphas.

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Hey, that one I only mentioned once if I recall correctly.

Hey sorry. Wasn't trying to single you out or anything. :o

That is one nasty bug though. It's a PITA to paint in a 3D viewport flawlessly, only to go to the UV viewport and have it be wonky. I hope that one is slated to be fixed.

PS- I noticed we can now use tools that go "outside" of the work area and into the viewport without dragging perspective. Thanks Andrew. :)

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Andrew, hi great job you are doing here.

I downloaded the "Mac" version (version 78) 2 days ago. Is this the latest mac version and if so do you know when V80 will be out for mac? Thanks

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Thank you very much Andrew for implementing mouse-customizations!

This is going to be very helpful.

Some first comments:

As these customizations do not only have to do with camera manipulation

they maybe instead should be placed inside the options-panel.

With the new mouse-mapping options it is also possible to create ambiguous

stuff.

In order to mimic the Rhino navigation I put camera rotation on RMB.

As it is necessary to be able at any time I made this functionality also active

when over the object. However: Quite a few other commands need RMB as well

(hardcoded), especially in Retopo-Commands (add points&faces, tweak etc.).

To solve problems like these Mouse Button actions might be classified

as following:

Click/Doubleclick (without draging)

Click/Doubleclick (without draging) + Hotkeys

Drag outside/over object without having objects selected

Drag with object selection (curve points, mesh vertices etc.) The selected objects should highlight.

Holger

Please describe how navigation is implemented in Rhino to understand it better.

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hi, i've got a lot of crash with alpha 8 0 when I switch between paint/scult/uv/retopo/voxel (especially between paint and voxel).

Some of the windows desappear and when i try to get them (by pressing shortcut) 3dcoat tell me run time error and crash.

(it don t happend all the time)

http://img301.imageshack.us/img301/9477/3dcruntime.jpg

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Please describe how navigation is implemented in Rhino to understand it better.

Here you are Andrew, the attached list should be relatively complete.

Further down I also added a link with visual examples of the camera manipulation which

are certainly much better to understand.

What I basically wanted to say with my last post is that those who want to change navigation hotkeys

in 3DC will likely run into some collisions with existing hardcoded keyboard actions on RMB, Shift or Ctrl.

Someone who wants to rotate the camera with RMB and also whats to tweak vertices or create faces

in Retopo (which also requires RMB) will have a problem. Those users who would like to rotate the camera

with Shift (not me) will not be able to use the Smooth functionality any more. And so on.

The makers of Silo have solved this in a way that they added huge pulldown menus and allowed remapping

of virtually all commands. There's no hardcoded keys inside Silo at all. I am not sure if it was neccessary

to this far with 3DC as it already in this state has a lot more commands than Silo.

That is why I proposed to add another state to your customization panel:

Dragging with or without an existing object selection. This way I could RMB select a point of a Retopo mesh and

3DC would understand when I start dragging that I want to tweak its position and not rotate the camera.

I hope this somehow makes sense, here now the list.

LMB = Pick Selection

LMB+Dragging over Object= unconstrained Object movement

LMB+Alt+Dragging with preselected Object=create object copy

LMB+Dragging outside of Objects=Draw Selection rectangle

LMB+Alt on top of nonselected object=special subobobject rectangular selection type (not applicable in 3DC)

MMB = customizable Popup-Menu (similar to marking menu)

MMB Scrolling=(optional) Camera zooming, can get disabled or reversed

RMB click = Context dependant functionality: either Enter or repetition of previous command

RMB held longer (optional) = custom popup menus dependent on preselected object-type.

In both RMB cases the mouse does not get moved.

RMB+dragging - in orthogonal viewports with parallel projection = Pan camera

RMB+dragging- in perspective viewports Orbit camera

RMB+Ctrl+dragging - Zoom Camera (in both orthogonal and perspective viewports)

RMB+Shift+dragging - Pan in perspective viewports

Advanced camera Manipulation-hotkey are also found here: http://en.wiki.mcneel.com/default.aspx/McN...nipulation.html

Holger

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Here you are Andrew, the attached list should be relatively complete.

Further down I also added a link with visual examples of the camera manipulation which

are certainly much better to understand.

What I basically wanted to say with my last post is that those who want to change navigation hotkeys

in 3DC will likely run into some collisions with existing hardcoded keyboard actions on RMB, Shift or Ctrl.

Someone who wants to rotate the camera with RMB and also whats to tweak vertices or create faces

in Retopo (which also requires RMB) will have a problem. Those users who would like to rotate the camera

with Shift (not me) will not be able to use the Smooth functionality any more. And so on.

The makers of Silo have solved this in a way that they added huge pulldown menus and allowed remapping

of virtually all commands. There's no hardcoded keys inside Silo at all. I am not sure if it was neccessary

to this far with 3DC as it already in this state has a lot more commands than Silo.

That is why I proposed to add another state to your customization panel:

Dragging with or without an existing object selection. This way I could RMB select a point of a Retopo mesh and

3DC would understand when I start dragging that I want to tweak its position and not rotate the camera.

I hope this somehow makes sense, here now the list.

LMB = Pick Selection

LMB+Dragging over Object= unconstrained Object movement

LMB+Alt+Dragging with preselected Object=create object copy

LMB+Dragging outside of Objects=Draw Selection rectangle

LMB+Alt on top of nonselected object=special subobobject rectangular selection type (not applicable in 3DC)

MMB = customizable Popup-Menu (similar to marking menu)

MMB Scrolling=(optional) Camera zooming, can get disabled or reversed

RMB click = Context dependant functionality: either Enter or repetition of previous command

RMB held longer (optional) = custom popup menus dependent on preselected object-type.

In both RMB cases the mouse does not get moved.

RMB+dragging - in orthogonal viewports with parallel projection = Pan camera

RMB+dragging- in perspective viewports Orbit camera

RMB+Ctrl+dragging - Zoom Camera (in both orthogonal and perspective viewports)

RMB+Shift+dragging - Pan in perspective viewports

Advanced camera Manipulation-hotkey are also found here: http://en.wiki.mcneel.com/default.aspx/McN...nipulation.html

Holger

What is better?

1) Skip automatically any navigation action if RMB deals with any kind of selected objects.

2) Assign separate action for all events like drag in retopo, change radius of curve etc...

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What is better?

1) Skip automatically any navigation action if RMB deals with any kind of selected objects.

2) Assign separate action for all events like drag in retopo, change radius of curve etc...

Puh, difficult to answer! One had to test this "hands on".

I guess it is way easier for you to suppress navigation with an existing object selection, no?

If in such a situation navigation still had to take place it could be accessed with an alternative method (e.g. Navi-panel).

The selected object in this case really should highlight so that one gets an idea why navigation doesn't work.

Maybe you should try #1 first and if it does not work out for people one could think of your second proposal.

The second of course gives great flexibility but needs quite a bit of planning for the user too...

It certainly made sense to hear other users experiences and opinions on this matter too.

Holger

PS- I have attached my first rough navigation scheme for your own testing.

rhino.zip

post-575-1241269224_thumb.jpg

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Hey Andrew,

Not sure if anyone else is getting this but in Voxel mode a few of my brushes sometimes disable. For instance the entire first menu disabled so I couldn't use build or 2D paint. Then using the bottom menu (draw, clay, flatten, etc.) the clay was working then all of a sudden it stopped working. The circular cursor disappears and doesn't lay down any strokes. But draw, flatten, and the others still worked.

Also, flatten doesn't work that well. Compared to ZBrush or Mudbox it feels unfinished to be honest. It's not flattening enough nor averaging with it's surrounding area. So you get very lumpy results.

Strange my last edit didn't take. Small wishlist working in retopology. I liked being able to right click in empty space and bringing up the menu. Is it still there and I'm missing the option? Any chance of implementing a drag selection method? Using a marquee box to select multiple verts/edges/faces is so much easier than shift/painting over them.

Very nice updates Andrew. The new UI and dockable windows is soo nice. I'm amazed at what you've implemented and how this app continues to grow. Great job.

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Hey sorry. Wasn't trying to single you out or anything. :o

That is one nasty bug though. It's a PITA to paint in a 3D viewport flawlessly, only to go to the UV viewport and have it be wonky. I hope that one is slated to be fixed.

PS- I noticed we can now use tools that go "outside" of the work area and into the viewport without dragging perspective. Thanks Andrew. :)

SWEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEETY Crips! That's something that's bugged me but I learned to live with it- now it's fixed!!!

Please Andrew- get some much needed rest!

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Ahh ok cool. :)

Man, 3DC has really evolved. It's such a powerful beast. I am loving this new interface. It's so much easier to find stuff now. Things are "where they should be" in comparison to before.

Thanks Andrew.

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Hey Andrew, I've been doing a lot UV work lately.

Would it be possible that when you're in the UV window that the location of your mouse, is highlighted on the mesh in a 3D viewport either by edges/vertices/polys? The reason this would be great, is for high density meshes where there are areas that you simply cannot tell what is going on. Inside of a large UV island. This of course, could be optional, but it would really help workflow.

Also another thing that would be absolutely great... Currently you can use a lot of the tools in 3DCoat in the UV window. Unfortunately though you cannot use the Retopology tools in the UV window. It would be amazing if we could. It would be the best UV and Retopology tools anywhere. Period. Especially having the Brush tool (by which you could smooth UVs!) in there, and the Stroke tool. This, I think, is one of my ultimate wants out of 3DC. :)

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In Zbrush, there is the ability to paint a mask directly on to the model before sculpting, so you only effect certain areas. Is there an equivalent to this in 3dcoat?

Sure is. I was just using them actually.

They are called Freezing in 3DC. The icon for is the 8 pointed star, just below the Erase tool and just above the Eye Drop tool.

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