stevecullum

Ptex format for 3DCoat?

130 posts in this topic

Ptex does support triangles, no n-gons though.

http://ptex.us/tritex.html

Hey thanks Phil, that's news to me. :) Good news in fact.

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I have to say great work Andrew, you are the fastest programmer on the planet as far as I'm concerned!

-Will

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It is almost equivalent to 1k x 1k. Actually 1k x 1k texture takes 700-800k pixels.

I don't know about price point. Possibly it will be free. At least for existing customers.

Anyway, I have no final point on this.

And the pipeline is easy - import object like it is for microvertices. Now only quads are supported. Local dencity can be changed. Of course I have not checked it, but it is relatively easy to do.

With all the improvements that have come with 3DC since v3, a modest price increase from $285 to $299 would make sense to me. You said early on that the price will increase in accord with the increase in features.

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No game engines and actually most other 3D programs right now do no support Ptex, though of course this may change quickly. So for now if you paint with Ptex you'd still have to make a UV map and bake the paint to that when you export.

Even then, UV editing is stupid fast in 3DC now...after all the work Andrew did to overhaul the toolset months ago, I don't do UV Unwrapping in 3ds Max anymore. So having to do UV's shouldn't cause any real heartburn.

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@AbnRanger

With all the improvements that have come with 3DC since v3, a modest price increase from $285 to $299 would make sense to me

Thanks to you to anticipate our participation in all that, but if you are so in hurry to pay, please do it for me...

cause i don't know for others but i'm not rich and i would prefer to have an option for that feature rather than an obligation...

i'd like more an "apply UV" button in retopo room without exporting or merging to apply the seams i made.

first let's finish and polish existing stuff and clarify workflow before facing new problems.

just my thought

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@AbnRanger

Thanks to you to anticipate our participation in all that, but if you are so in hurry to pay, please do it for me...

cause i don't know for others but i'm not rich and i would prefer to have an option for that feature rather than an obligation...

i'd like more an "apply UV" button in retopo room without exporting or merging to apply the seams i made.

first let's finish and polish existing stuff and clarify workflow before facing new problems.

just my thought

Andrew stated when v3 was released that as more features were added the price would correspond. Since then, a ton of features and improvements were added...so with those and PTex, an extra $15 is more than worth it, for those that have yet to purchase the application. If you're going to throw a fit over $15, then maybe you should be looking elsewhere. Maybe Blender is your cup of tea. There are standalone UV editing applications that cost more than 3DC:

http://www.polygonal-design.fr/e_unfold/ccov.php

There are 3D Painting applications that cost 2-3 times more:

http://www.maxonshop.com/us/ps/code=BP-N-4&act=gpage

https://store.righthemisphere.com/categories/entertainment-bundle

http://www.righthemisphere.com/products/dp3d/Deep3D_UV/index.html

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Andrew stated when v3 was released that as more features were added the price would correspond.

Actually he said it much longer ago than that, when I first bought 3DC (3DB at the time) it was $70. As the features grew the price went up.

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I agree with demether, 299$ is too much for 3DC, you can get Zbrush 3.5R3 with free update to Zbrush4 for 510$,industry standard with TONS of videos and free support on youtube(many great and free tutorials) and Zbrush community.3DC has very small community,not enough educational resources(Voxels?),manual needs to be much better for such complicated software.

I'm glad I snatched 3DC cheaply but I dont think I would ever pay 299$ or even current price.

I bought 3DC for painting and retopo,most updates and work were put unfortunately into Voxels.Voxels are not that much useful - learning curve is steep, you need hardware to run it fast (nVidia card with CUDA),educational resources and manual are limited,workflow complicated ,look at forums everybody is using Zbrush/Mudbox.Even in 3DC own forum it not that many WIPs.

A lot things needs to be cleaned and ironed out,paint mode and retopo mode could get some love ? I don't think Ptex would bring a lot new customers but pricing to 299$ for sure will make some consider Zbrush instead.

@AbnRanger They can charge more because software like DeepPaint or BodyPaint is industry established brand,besides nobody buys BodyPaint standalone you get it as bundle with C4D.

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I agree with demether, 299$ is too much for 3DC, you can get Zbrush 3.5R3 with free update to Zbrush4 for 510$,industry standard with TONS of videos and free support on youtube(many great and free tutorials) and Zbrush community.3DC has very small community,not enough educational resources(Voxels?),manual needs to be much better for such complicated software.

I'm glad I snatched 3DC cheaply but I dont think I would ever pay 299$ or even current price.

I bought 3DC for painting and retopo,most updates and work were put unfortunately into Voxels.Voxels are not that much useful - learning curve is steep, you need hardware to run it fast (nVidia card with CUDA),educational resources and manual are limited,workflow complicated ,look at forums everybody is using Zbrush/Mudbox.Even in 3DC own forum it not that many WIPs.

A lot things needs to be cleaned and ironed out,paint mode and retopo mode could get some love ? I don't think Ptex would bring a lot new customers but pricing to 299$ for sure will make some consider Zbrush instead.

@AbnRanger They can charge more because software like DeepPaint or BodyPaint is industry established brand,besides nobody buys BodyPaint standalone you get it as bundle with C4D.

BodyPaint was expensive as a standalone. They incorporated it within the C4D, and that forces you buy the base version whether you want it or not...Deep Paint is what I used...they have all but abandoned it...never had any video tutorials. And it no longer works with Vista or Win 7.

You may not think 3DC is worth it, but ZBrush is $600: http://www.pixologic.com/store/ And Mudbox is $750

If you need a serious 3D Painting application that has top shelf UV layout tools and approaches ZB and MB in sculpting ability...3DC is a heck of a deal at half the price of ZB.

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Nobody forces someone to by a software. It is always a decision of you. If someone doesn't need 3D Coats functionality, this is ok.

zBrush went a long way to be where the tool is placed today. It was a hobby project at the early beginning. zBrush needed years to build such a community, like it is today. 3D Coat is new in the market. And nobody can expect a perfect software or dozens of tutorials in one or two years of developement. Especially when there is a big competition with tools, which are already established in the market.

In my opinion every software lives with and from the users (Hope you understand my english?). The users are important in two ways: First, to allow the developers to earn enough money to produce a better software and second, the users build and are the community which serves all the needed tutorials and feedback. The developers are not able to manage such a big task themself. Only a big interest group can safe a good position in the market.

So, please don't compare the tools in such a way, like I read here. Try to stay objective. If you need 3D Coat, it's nice, if you need zBrush it's nice, too. If you need both, hey - why not? Use the tools you need.

Best wishes

Chris

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While i don't like to keep paying for updates for the software i own i understand that the developer needs to earn money from this and also the amount of work that must go into this. This is a great app and it can already do a lot of things so it is worth the price and also cheaper than many other apps as said. The fact Zbrush gets free updates is not that good of a point as first it costs more and there has been many free updates for 3DC and it's always getting cool new stuff so it will grow in features over time.

For this though Andrew said it would probably be a plugin and maybe even get released free for customers. If it was a plugin it would be optional also so you would only get it if you needed the features but tha main app would probably get more free updates still untill the next major release.

For training there is the Tutorials area, Video Manual and wiki so quite a lot of stuff. The main thing i don't see for 3DC as much as with ZB is the walkthrough type stuff but often those don't show how things were done fully but people are starting to do this more here with progress stages images and tips etc. With 3DC/voxels though it's mainly just needing to know how to use the tools which is done quite well already and a good understanding of art/sculpting though as it's mainly down to the users skills also.

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I think everyone's threshold for cost is different depending on how they use the software.

If it's hobbiest use then any cost is "expensive" except of course people pay $1,000's on their hobbies so why not software?

From a professional point of view, $200 is virtually free. We pay $50k or more _per year_ for Maya, Houdini, Nuke etc maintenance. Money well spent since it means new updates to the software, bug fixes etc.

I find 3DC a much better deal than Zbrush because even though the ZBrush updates are "free" they're often useless, from a professional point of view. Andrew has been very responsive to user's needs both feature-wise and also the "boring" tech stuff that professionals need. Pixologic, not so much.

From a hobbiest point of view, I like the low cost. From a professional point of view, I'd like 3DC to be more expensive so Andrew can hire a bigger team and get more done faster :) That's really what it comes down to. From what I've seen Andrew is an insanely fast coder, but he's still human and I bet his wife and kids like to see him occasionally :)

Houdini have a great solution to this: For hobbiests they offer Houdini Apprentice HD which is their non-commercial version but at full resolution, with access to the Amazon Render Cloud. It's $99.

For professionals, they offer $2k or $7k versions (like Maya complete and unlimited) which lets a studio only buy what they actually need.

Anyway, I'm not picking a fight here, I think everyone's opinions here are valid but selfishly, I want more faster and am willing to pay for it :)

Cheers,

Peter B

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BodyPaint was expensive as a standalone. They incorporated it within the C4D, and that forces you buy the base version whether you want it or not...Deep Paint is what I used...they have all but abandoned it...never had any video tutorials. And it no longer works with Vista or Win 7.

You may not think 3DC is worth it, but ZBrush is $600: http://www.pixologic.com/store/ And Mudbox is $750

If you need a serious 3D Painting application that has top shelf UV layout tools and approaches ZB and MB in sculpting ability...3DC is a heck of a deal at half the price of ZB.

595$ is official price but it is being sold by their official digital etailer for 510$, so if 3DC is priced to 300$ or more it's less than 200$ difference.3DC approaches ZB/MB in sculpting ability but the problem is voxels are nowhere that useful like ZB/MuD polygon sculpting and it's faster on most computers and they can do polypaint and hell a lot of more.

3DC is worth if you can justify buying it, but many people won't be able to justify buying both.

You guys bought your 3DC for 70$ or 130$, didn't you ? :)

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595$ is official price but it is being sold by their official digital etailer for 510$, so if 3DC is priced to 300$ or more it's less than 200$ difference.

You guys bought your 3DC for 70$ or 130$, didn't you ? :)

Actually if you want to talk about discounts you could buy 3DC during the 30 day trial and get $50 off, bringing the price down the $250 (currently $235)

I bought in at $70 originally.

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I fail to see the logic reasoning why people would not want this type of tech in 3DC. It shaves hours of work and improves the quality for all who do texturing, and then you wanna sell that as a separate module ?!

/ Magnus

Just wanted to second that opinion in my view it would be against 3dc best interest to make people pay for another module ...worst comes to worst make the price of the soft a tad higher and put everything you can in because a tool like that well integrated can make a huge difference on the user base numbers especially at this time where very few quality tools make use of this and it is in the forseeable future that this way of painting will become the norm

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595$ is official price but it is being sold by their official digital etailer for 510$, so if 3DC is priced to 300$ or more it's less than 200$ difference.3DC approaches ZB/MB in sculpting ability but the problem is voxels are nowhere that useful like ZB/MuD polygon sculpting and it's faster on most computers and they can do polypaint and hell a lot of more.

3DC is worth if you can justify buying it, but many people won't be able to justify buying both.

You guys bought your 3DC for 70$ or 130$, didn't you ? :)

Nope...I bought 3DC right after v3 was released. And I primarily bought it as a 3D Painting replacement for Deep Paint 3D (which is essentially dead as they aren't supporting it). It was well worth it just for that...and now, the UV layout tools make it even more so. That's not even mentioning Voxel Clay sculpting and such. So...you're trying to compare it to ZBrush based on sculpting, but that's not an accurate comparison. 3DC is first a 3D Painting application...and in that capacity, is heads and shoulders above ZB and MB. Therefore, your comment about the price difference is only relative to less than half of the toolset.

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One reason i got 3DC was the price point. Being mainly a hobbiest artists i second what people have said about that it can be a bad thing when prices keep going up. I have some software and even though they are great i cannot afford to keep updating them as they keep putting the prices up a large amount each release etc, this i do not like and when i buy apps i usually go for the lower priced things.

This is the reason i like 3DC a lot is it's affordable yet still offers very powerful features for my art, the softwares at double the price+ i would rather just buy a new laptop etc with the same amount of money. The point i guess im trying to make is there should always be a max price point (around) for some things rather than just going up and up as then it cuts out a lot of possible buyers when that happens. So with features like this if it is ever going to boost the price a great deal i like the idea of plugins as it's a optional thing rather than increasing the amount of the whole package.

To be honest though im not sure why the topic has gone this way, it was on topic then now it's about software prices even though nothing has been said for definate yet. Andrew even said that this could even be free and would possibly be a plugin (so a optional buy if it had a price) and theres been many free updates. Nothings official yet as far as i know so lets get back on topic :D

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I thought this was a discussion about Ptex not about price points, besides we are just end users what right do we have to discuss business strategy?

Im interested to see how ptex would work, especially how well it would bake to a lowpoly model??

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I thought this was a discussion about Ptex not about price points, besides we are just end users what right do we have to discuss business strategy?

Im interested to see how ptex would work, especially how well it would bake to a lowpoly model??

It was a response to Andrew's mention of adding it as a separate plugin, or making it free to current license owners.

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So what does everybody think of the new ipad from Apple?

Does it support Ptex? :D

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My very first experience with Ptex has been awesome if you haven't tried it yet go run do so now! :rofl:

2010-02-02_1412.png

2010-02-02_1410.png

2010-02-02_1413.png

2010-02-02_1407.png

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The ptex texture res is currently not scalable. So the ptex alpha version is nice, but not more. OK, a little bit more: It's really fast to paint. :)

But I am very curious, nevertheless.

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Sure it is, I'm doing it right now.

Just click here:

2010-02-02_1441.png

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This is cool! :drinks:

It would be nice if there was some visual feedback when the res was increased or decreased. When it does come to creating an export and baking what there is to UV's, it would be good if 3D Coat could auto magically determine the map resoultion required to preserve the details. Either that or create a set of plugins for apps you want to support - which could be a useful way to hook in a few more customers. :)

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