Advanced Member michalis Posted May 18, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 18, 2010 Starting a new project and maybe sketching a tutorial. Its from a blond Kouros in Acropolis Athens museum ~480 BC. Still at 1M and symmetry. Its gonna be difficult, these "Kouros' statues have a great hidden geometry. Some yellow ochre still remains on his hair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor 3d_sculptress Posted May 18, 2010 Contributor Report Share Posted May 18, 2010 looking good...would love to see a tutorial on this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 20, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 20, 2010 Thanks 3d sculptress. Meanwhile, testing some textures and sss in blender. Its still a low poly model still having problems with retopo room (this time 'relax' did it) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor digman Posted May 20, 2010 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted May 20, 2010 This kind of work in ideally suited for 3DCoat using voxels. Looking forward to seeing this sculpt progress. What version of Blender are you using for the renders? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 20, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 20, 2010 @digman: I'm using 2.49b for basic modeler but render branch 2.5.2 for rendering (64bit build from graphicall.org). Its a very fast render engine. For this kind of work (no rigging) a decimated tri model exported from voxels works fine. But I'm trying to learn retopo and other adopting technics here. These archaic 'kouros' statues look like they don't need crisp details. Quiet wrong. Modeling these is a nightmare, try it to see for yourself. Hair should not look like the above render. Now I increased resolution and sculpting again, thinking that I should export a high res from multiverts to zbrush and do the final sculpt there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 20, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 20, 2010 I just managed to save all this work (exported a higher res model, no textures) opened in blender and cleaned it, some nice UVs there (the best UV editior I know), reconstructed subdivisions in zbrush, ready to sculpt. Used subdivisions in retopo for this (microvertex was a disaster), after some crashes 3DC collapsed and waiting now someone to help me fix it. Not exactly the tutorial I had in mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 22, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 22, 2010 Another small 3DC adventure came to an end (I think). Rendered in blender, apps used to sculpt and paint, 3DC, zbrush, blender (all the three of them lol). This is a 15k model but a multires model, meaning you can do any rigging and animation you want but the renderer will see some 800K + normal maps. Much much better than displacement maps. But I need zbrush and blender to do this. Subdivisions in 3DC ( retopo room) doesn't work the way it should, sorry, this may be the reason why we don't have multi res modeling in 3dc (this was a question to Andrew). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member GED Posted May 24, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 24, 2010 very good finish, would be wierd to see it animated Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 27, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 27, 2010 thanks ged, I never tried to learn how to animate, maybe I will. But enough with all these antiquities, I started an old fisherman's portrait, some great stories about this guy, he is 82 years old now. And a watercolor I painted in front this model last summer. For the moment I'm not sure if I'll go for a realistic portrait or do just some sculpts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taros Posted May 27, 2010 Report Share Posted May 27, 2010 I love the waterpainting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 27, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 27, 2010 Hey thanks Taros, traditional painting is my favorite, waterpainting especially. Paper is the medium not paints. A hand made heavy and expensive wet paper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applink Developer haikalle Posted May 27, 2010 Applink Developer Report Share Posted May 27, 2010 Very impressive. Both works. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 27, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 27, 2010 thanks haikalle, now this sculpt is at 200k, I can subdivide it at 800 k or once more (better because I don't like to loose crispness every time I subdivide) and finish it. (retopo UVs after). Or I can retopo right now and go for blender and zbrush. Your advice? I may prefer the second because I own zb and this is a stable workflow. It is the way that 3DC subdivides topology that frightens me. Where is the 'Catmull-Clark' method? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applink Developer haikalle Posted May 27, 2010 Applink Developer Report Share Posted May 27, 2010 I have been also wondered about the way how 3dc subdivides topology. There is something odd going on but in the end it gives okey results. Right now How I work is that I try to take Meshes as low resolution as I can out from 3d-coat. Then using normal/bump and disp maps to build my model. Right now I'm using Vray/Blender and it uses python to calc your meshes and if you have very high poly mesh it can take a long time to calc. I should say that 200k is enough but in the end you have test it and see which way is better....Just remember to tell me the results of your tests Also, if you have some free time, try 3d-coat with houdini. I think that houdini is the best program out there that handles 3d-coat disp maps amazingly well. It just pure joy. Houdini is quite complex program so building the rest of your shader can take a time but with 3d-coat disp maps, houdini really masters it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 27, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 27, 2010 I did some new tests using zbrush to blender multi-res import. I had the best and accurate results when exported one by one resolution from zbrush and using shrinkwrap four times. This is a 800k model after four subdivisions. The difference between the zbrush and blender preview is because zbrush renders quads using gradient, blender uses a flat colour always. Same technic using 3DC is not practical (lot of artifacts) due to loss of Catmull-Clark method, Anyway have a look. This came from 3DC, being a guad mesh, zbrush could re-construct subdivisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 29, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2010 I decided to use the 3DC to zbrush workflow. I'm also trying to improve my retopo skills. I never liked retopo, how wrong I was... This is a 2k base model, up to 100k now and still some nice details, so this is what nice topology does. What do you think about the likeness? He's an old fisherman, a modern pirate an ex contraband man. At least he drinks as a pirate. At 83... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted May 29, 2010 Contributor Report Share Posted May 29, 2010 I decided to use the 3DC to zbrush workflow. I'm also trying to improve my retopo skills. I never liked retopo, how wrong I was... This is a 2k base model, up to 100k now and still some nice details, so this is what nice topology does. What do you think about the likeness? He's an old fisherman, a modern pirate an ex contraband man. At least he drinks as a pirate. At 83... Likeness is very good I think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Calabi Posted May 29, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2010 Cool, really nice details and characterful face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 29, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2010 Thanks, artman, calabi. Where can I find a good tutorial about topology? I found some but these have to do with simple animated faces, more precise sculpture needs something more. Its so difficult to have square quads only. I used quads only here, so I followed artman's advice (rebuild subdivisions in zbrush). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Calabi Posted May 29, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2010 Here's a couple of good ones. http://www.phungdinhdung.org/Studies_paper/Realistic_face_modeling.shtm http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?t=93651 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted May 29, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2010 Thanks calabi, these are the tutorials I was talking about, the problem maybe has not a solution Try to model some ancient sculpture and we'll see what these topo tricks can do Try especially to model archaic hair. Or some Feidias's drapery (Elgin marbles, british museum). Too many clear triangulated shapes there, you see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Calabi Posted May 29, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 29, 2010 I've got plenty more but their not much better. I had the same trouble with my bat head(I gave up eventually) didnt matter because its not going to be animated or sculpted further. I think its just a matter of terminating the edge loops correctly like in that blender thread, if your just looking for all quads. Perhaps a matter of practice and knowledge you cant be taught. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted June 12, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted June 12, 2010 A week later, alone at last, some progress. Zbrush again, starting in voxels room, topology, subdivide, reconstruct subdivisions in zbrush. All I can do for the moment. I'm planing to texture it in 3dcoat. We'll see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Greg Posted June 12, 2010 Contributor Report Share Posted June 12, 2010 Beautiful work! Thanks for sharing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted June 13, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted June 13, 2010 some more fixes and a copper matcap. I hope to save some time to finish this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted June 14, 2010 Contributor Report Share Posted June 14, 2010 Very nice! Just to refresh, how much was done in 3DC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted June 14, 2010 Author Advanced Member Report Share Posted June 14, 2010 Thanks tony nemo. I already posted what I did in 3dc. Basic sculpture (voxels concept sculpture is a more precise word because this makes clear what we have in mind, not just a box modeling). Retopology then, subdivisions and export in zbrush (re-construct subs there) etc. This is my way to say: 3DCoat is not a stand alone app as it is. Voxels are great (my favorite) but when jumping to a surface mode, I'm not expecting a way back to voxels, I'm expecting to find a zbrush like room. With all these goodies there. And a friendly GPU environment. Capable to bake AO normals bumps displacements materials etc. Now I'll import this again to 3dc (UVs already there) and paint it. I'll import it to blender and bake AO too. I own a license of zbrush already so this is my workflow. It costs a zbrush+3DC... +blender lol Now, tony nemo, 'just to refresh' : A question. How many models in the official 3DC gallery are made using zbrush? There is at least (a good one) that can be found in the official zbrush gallery too. I don't believe in stand alone apps anyway. I can't find a better workflow to construct this portrait here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor digman Posted June 14, 2010 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted June 14, 2010 This gentleman is somewhat old but with a rugged quality about him, A man who has known hard work in his life(a little beaten down by the years of work too),(my interpretation) Great work again, Michalis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted June 14, 2010 Contributor Report Share Posted June 14, 2010 Now, tony nemo, 'just to refresh' : A question. How many models in the official 3DC gallery are made using zbrush? There is at least (a good one) that can be found in the official zbrush gallery too. I don't believe in stand alone apps anyway. I can't find a better workflow to construct this portrait here. Thanks for your clarification, Michalis. C4D is my basic app but 3DC is my only sculpting app, so I rely on Andrew to develop it's attributes. So far, his development is faster than my need for stand alone sculpting/painting (I am currently busy trying to animate getting into and out of a lotus pose). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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