Looking at 3DCoat

[hrgiger]

I'm interested in trying out the 3DCoat demo and just wanted to ask a few questions before I install.

Curious about which version to install. I am using Windows 64bit but I'm wondering if I should go for the Cuda vs Non-Cuda version? Any disadvantages to running the Cuda version? My current graphics card is the Nvidia GTX 285.

I am currently using Zbrush but am interested in trying out the voxel sculpting becauuse I really dislike the topoological constraints I sometimes run into. Was wondering if I could hear from anyone who maybe have some experience in both programs to give their opinions on this.

Thanks in advance.

-HR

[Javis]

Hey HR, glad to see you here.

With your video card, you should see a substantial boost in voxel sculpting. The more GPUs the better when it comes to voxel sculpting. The CUDA version should run quite well with that video card.

To compare ZB<>3DC, one can instantly see the technical & artistic limitations of sculpting with polygons (sculpting with out dynamic tessellation). Voxels are really great, and as you mentioned, you can sculpt freely without too much worry on topology until you're ready to export.

By the same token, voxels do consume a lot more memory than polygons and also the files can be quite large with voxels (I've become accustomed to using 7z for my .3B files).

All that said, right now is an interesting time for 3DC since the addition of LiveClay for sculpting polygons (dynamic tessellation!) and sub-cell resolution for voxels. Having all of these different sculpting features should really put 3DC in a unique spot for users to take advantage of, and really for the first time, have the best of all options as far as sculpting goes.

[michalis]

As geothefaust said. +1

Meanwhile, you won't find in 3dcoat the quality of zbrush or sculptris sculpting tools. You won't find an after retopology sculpting room with similar to voxels-surfmode tools. But you have zbrush for this job.

because I really dislike the topoological constraints I sometimes run into

In your case, a nice workflow could be: start in voxels room, don't go to for hi-density and hi frequency details. Retopo it (manually or auto), do UVs (manually) . Learn these tools well. Bake for MicroVertices mode, export a hi density mesh. Now import in zbrush and reconstruct subdivisions.

In retopo room try to avoid n-gons.

But my best suggestion is to learn 3dcoat, to forget zbrush for the moment. You may love it, it's a different approach.

[AbnRanger]

With your card and 8-12GB's of RAM, you should be able to do just about whatever you want to do in Voxels...even uber high detail. I keep hearing that it can't, but it darn well can...you just need to utilize some of the built-in tools to help localize the heavy detail where you want/need it, and to cache layers that you aren't actively working on. You can even save layers to their own .3b file, delete it from the scene and bring it back in when you are ready. You can also just drag and drop a layer into the model pallet or Spline pallet (to use with the Curves tool), and have an obj. To use at your whim...similar functionality as Subtools in ZBrush. Thumbnails and all.

Voxel sculpting performance has improved by leaps and bounds over just the past year, and with LiveClay already in Beta....it's about to take an even bigger step. Raul is from Cuba if I recall correctly, and he is supposed to join Andrew and crew in Kiev late this summer. That will speed things up considerably, on that front. Like any software, 3DC has it's flaws here and there, but I think the best thing about it is that the major toolsets in 3DC are all among the best in the industry, in any software.

I find 3D Coat's Retopo toolset to be the best overall, especially if you count Autopo in that assessment. Autopo isn't the best option for things like Characters, but apart from that, it really does a surprisingly good job...especially if you're in a real pinch for time. The Pose Tool has gotten a major boost recently, with the inclusion of the Freeform lattice. That makes it more versatile than the Pose tool in Mudbox, in my opinion. In fact, I remember asking Andrew about the possibility of this very function less than a year ago. So, the fact that he takes input from the community seriously, is a major bonus for the application in itself. I'm not sure the average person would see their input/ideas actually implemented in the software, elsewhere.

I use the UV layout in 3DC for practically everything I model, now. Very fast and super easy to get great results the first shot.

The Texture UV editor in the Paint Room is much like having Photoshop open right in the viewport. You have the image picker which lets you load multiple reference images, and you can dock it wherever you like, and zoom in, pan around, and even use the color drop tool to sample/select colors from the image displayed in the color picker.

Overall, it's great as either an alternative to ZB or MB or as a companion.

[BeatKitano]

You can't even compare mudbox and 3dc as alternative... Mudbox is waaaay behind.

Anyway I agree you can do whatever you want detail wise in 3dc with a powerful machine, but it's simply not very practical, but liveclay will definetely anihilate that little problem... Can't wait for the next build (with reduction tool), it's probably the sculpting software I imagined since using amorphium back in the late 90's Freeform sculpting without real limit other than your imagination

Amorphium for those who never had a chance to try it:

BTW HRgiger, we are already friends (even if you don't want to !), I'm a "fanatic fan" of his work :=)

[AbnRanger]

Just think...that UI is what Greg wants for 3D Coat. We have GOT to keeps his hands away from the controls, folks.

[Grandmaster B]

By all means

[BeatKitano]

Ahaha yah that UI was terrifying.... But it was the first of his kind on public market (movie studio already had some in house tools much better than this at the time on SGI platforms)...

Then came the first 0.93 beta of zbrush and his pixols, that was awesome but sooo limited in the 3d area (much more like painting 2d with depth).

I feel like we are reviving the same things again, a second renaissance for 3d sculpt with dynamic tesselation opening the doors of a new realm of creativity

[pavig]

I am currently using Zbrush but am interested in trying out the voxel sculpting becauuse I really dislike the topoological constraints I sometimes run into. Was wondering if I could hear from anyone who maybe have some experience in both programs to give their opinions on this.

If topological constraints in ZB cause you grief, you'll love 3dc. It is a much more natural environment for organic sculpting. With a ZB workflow you often need to break in and out of ZB to play with topology if you're doing freeform work. Voxels have no such constraint.

The difference is that there is no difference between fine surface bump painting and broad strokes in ZB. Using voxels you map out your broad strokes first, and can produce fairly fine detail, but you (usually) wait until you've turned it into polys before painting fine bump detail or color. This two step process has advantages and disadvantages, and is the main frustration ZB users face in learning 3dc. Once it clicks though, it is a much more fluid workflow for character or organic modeling.

I would like to go back to using ZB occasionally as there are a few things it does extremely well, but I find I don't miss it very much using 3dc. Both z-brush and 3d-coat are extremely idiosyncratic applications though. There's nothing quite like either of them, as they both evolved out of niche tools. You will probably find the 3d-coat way rather strange until you get to know it well, but behind the quirks is an extremely powerful tool. Once you become comfortable with voxels, you'll wonder how you ever worked without them.

[michalis]

+1 on most of what you say guys. (except this '3dcoat sculpting tools are comparable with pixo's ones')

What surprises me is that most of zbrush users never tried sculptris. Especially now, as a fine GoZ link exists.

I remember (being a macuser) when pixo demonstrated z-sketch in v3.5 win only. Wow, I could not resist and I tried 3dcoat, bought it the same night LOL.

But what a beautiful surprise it was! A different approach.

I have the feeling that most of zbrush users don't even know what dynamic tessellation (any kind) means. This, and the lack of a decent retopo tool. Weird...

[hrgiger]

Ok, thanks for all the feedback guys. I installed the Cuda 64 bit version and it seems to be running fine. I will give it a go over the next few weeks and see if I can get comfortable with it.