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Andrew Shpagin

V4.1 BETA (experimental 4.1.17D)

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Mesh explosions and tears in the mesh,

 

I noticed a increased in users reporting these are happening. I get them too though alot more rare, not like before but they do still exist.

One area that still seems to have some trouble is when you switch between LiveClay brushes and Regular sculpting brushes. 

One time that I noticed a hole appearing was changing from a liveclay brush and I started using the normal rapid brush, not rapid2...

This area at one time was a major cause of tears. I'm sure that is not the only area that causes them...

Once version 4.0.10beta is released and before Raul leaves another round of squashing these bugs would be considered.

 

Fixing holes on very dense meshes is time consuming and they are hard to see by that stage as reported by users...

 

Surface mode and LiveClay are great additions but the holes and explosions at some point need to be stamped out completely to make surface mode in general to be worry free...

Linux version 64 bit non-cuda 4.0.09 beta.

Edited by digman

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Just want to say that 4.0.0.9 worked like a beast during a recent multiple-day art test I took recently. Really put the program through it's paces for long periods of time. It crashed one time and I think that was more a result of some funky drivers from NVIDIA. I am so impressed with all the functionality of 3DC. It's an amazing program. Thanks to Andrew, Raul, Volokh, Sergyi and everyone else I failed to mention who works on 3DC. Love this program!

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Ok, I ran a quick test...

I used the build LC brush, Then switched to the Rapid surface brush with no remove stretching...

Made several strokes on top of the LC brush strokes.

I use the undo a few times and then added more Rapid brush strokes and produced this hole in the mesh shown in the picture.

 

It appears that the undo memory is getting corrupted, a possible source of some of the mesh tear problem.

Mantis report "0001310 also gets mesh corruption using undo...

 

These type of small tears can be easy to overlook but in a later part of the sculpting can cause those big spikes or an explosion.

 

Like I said it my first post above, these are much rarer but still happen...

 

Posted Mantis bug report "0001313"

post-518-0-51122900-1384986016_thumb.png

Edited by digman

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Ok, I ran a quick test...

I used the build LC brush, Then switched to the Rapid surface brush with no remove stretching...

Made several strokes on top of the LC brush strokes.

I use the undo a few times and then added more Rapid brush strokes and produced this hole in the mesh shown in the picture.

 

It appears that the undo memory is getting corrupted, a possible source of some of the mesh tear problem.

Mantis report "0001310 also gets mesh corruption using undo...

 

These type of small tears can be easy to overlook but in a later part of the sculpting can cause those big spikes or an explosion.

 

Like I said it my first post above, these are much rarer but still happen...

 

Posted Mantis bug report "0001313"

yeah it would be cool if it would  be deeply investigated and fixed once and for all..

Sym copy really creates situations where  holes/explosions can happen....

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In addition the the holes and tears (which have become the bane of the program for me), I think I should ask if maybe the tablet people use could be part of the issue? I have a regular bamboo wacom, and this has been happening since using version 3.7 on the Mac, and now it happens in all version of 4 I've used (I'm using this latest beta, 4.0.0.9): sometimes my strokes hang for a few seconds, then the program catches up and a far too deep stroke appears, or other times nothing at all, yet the polygon count increases a lot on the mesh. I undo, and continue on, but that's odd.

 

Also, when just opening the program, or after doing major operations like a move with the pose tool, closing a hole, etc., my wacom no longer works, or using it to zoom in, rotate, or move the model can cause the model to flip and shoot across out of frame. It's completely unregulated movement (on Orthographic view). Sometimes also the brush strokes stop working with pressure, hang, or it confuses pressing to create a stroke with expanding the brush size. Basically, some truly schizophrenic behavior. Most times this is fixed by clicking outside of 3D-Coat and then back into it. Sometimes it needs a full restart (and even rarer I've only been able to resolve it by a full restart of my system). Again, that's happened on 3.7 on Mac, v4 stable release, and the betas on PC until now.

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Andrew would it be hard to add specular to the Clone tool and to the the Fill tool (like in Material tool)?

I think is especially important in the Clone tool  otherwize layering does not match anymore... :(

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Indeed, that bothered me quite a bit in the second challenge when painting symmetry wasn't working and couldn't use the clone tool with symmetry option on specular.

 

On another note, I'm really bothered "hide but current" doesn't work in all rooms, in the paint room especially. I have to go back to sculpt room activate it there to isolate the mesh I want, and go back to paint room.

I find alt clicking the eye icon very slow when working with a dozen of meshes in the voxtree since I'm relying almost exclusively on shortcuts (like I always do in every software).

 

Right now I use a preset hotkey to go to paint, see that I can't isolate quickly, go back to sculpt room with another, press my hotkey for hide but current, then press another time to go back to paint.

 

It makes 4 hotkeys which should only be 2 (press paint room hotkey, then hide but current). Not much you would say, yes, but add that on a project with empirical paint/sculpt and you lose an incredible amount of time.

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Improved Perceptions Of Depth: Saved Light Positions as Presets- Saved Background Colors as Presets,

 

Andrew, would it be possible in the sculpting windows (voxel and surface) to allow lighting positions and settings to be saved as presets?

Having the ability to switch light positions quickly whilst being able to quickly return to a good default position would greatly speed up sculpting because it would help to better assess brush depths quickly in certain areas.

 

Having shadow exposure/ intensity controls would also help sculpting in occluded areas but for the present switching to saved light positions to expose shaded areas would help enormously.

 

For perceptions of depth and to aid tonality sculpting - background color presets for the sculpting windows may also be useful.

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And save render presets in the 3B files, but not override the current scene settings when you import/merge another 3b file... Having to redo all the setup if you want to merge file is a pain.

 

Also make each room lighting independant: tweaking light brightness in sculpt room, for better sculpt assessment, resulting in overexposed light in render room is really not cool.

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3DC nightmare = holes and tears :angry:

 

please fix it once and for all <_<

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3DC nightmare = holes and tears :angry:

 

please fix it once and for all <_<

Yes, Yes................. :dash2:

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Is there a way in retopo room that when you ctrl d or deselect, it does not go to auto? Its really breaking the modelling flow when you're selecting in poly mode, then deselect it goes to auto mode.

 

Also can bevel be improved. It should be more like inset.

jkaa6d.jpg

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I believe Free Extrude is the same as Inset or Bevel in Max or Extrude in Maya. Bevel pushes the new geometry outward and inward at the same time. So, it's a different creature. I get a little irritated by the Auto-thingy as well. Currently just set hotkeys for the different sub-objects/elements and use those to quickly switch modes, but it would be nice to see it changed, so it stayed in the last mode you used. I requested a bunch of these Retopo room improvements and haven't seen any movement on them at all....so good luck with that.

 

Being able to SHIFT + Drag with the TRANSFORM tool active, to extrude new edges/polygons on the fly would be SO dang helpful...not just for Retopo work...but if someone wanted to quickly Poly model something in the Retopo Room. for example, if you wanted to go back and model a mouth cavity, it's not so easy to do, currently, in the Retopo Room. You can't use Free Extrude on an open edges

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I just checked to see if the new bezier options have been added to the Bridge tool (they're not) and found that the tool is not working at all. The only thing it does is act like it's applying Reconstruct or Live Clay to the selected area. Otherwise the area remains flat and unchanged.  Anyone else seeing this?

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I just checked to see if the new bezier options have been added to the Bridge tool (they're not) and found that the tool is not working at all. The only thing it does is act like it's applying Reconstruct or Live Clay to the selected area. Otherwise the area remains flat and unchanged.  Anyone else seeing this?

Bridge tool works fine on my side in 4.0.09dx64. Of course both objects need to be on the same vox layer,also no more than 2 selections must be made .

New Bezier options are not there since Andrew merged Raul's code in next update (4.0.10)  so it is not in 4.0.09 yet.

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Curious, that's the same version I'm using.  I'll have to try again I guess.  I hope 4.0.10 comes soon I could use that bezier option in my current project.

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Bridge tool works fine on my side in 4.0.09dx64. Of course both objects need to be on the same vox layer,also no more than 2 selections must be made .

New Bezier options are not there since Andrew merged Raul's code in next update (4.0.10)  so it is not in 4.0.09 yet.

 

This should be clear for a user, btw.

There are alot functions which seems to be available, but dont work if you try them, because you didnt use the "right way" for that function. (e.g. right cllick menu "merge" or "intersect" for volumes on voxtree in surface-mode.... works only properly in Voxel-Mode)

Edited by chingchong

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Is there a way in retopo room that when you ctrl d or deselect, it does not go to auto? Its really breaking the modelling flow when you're selecting in poly mode, then deselect it goes to auto mode.

You can force it via script, but if won't work with Ctrl + D, only by pressing button.

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Ok, here is another mess of a mesh explosion.... :wacko:

 

Ran cleanup memory because of a mesh problem.

First example shown in picture:

I had ran clean up memory in surface mode before doing the below because of a small problem.

Switched to voxel mode and ran fill voids. Switched back to surface mode and used the Smooth All tool set using tangent smoothing only. Blam explosion..

2nd example shown in picture:

Switched to voxel mode and ran fill voids and close invisible hulls.

Switched back to surface mode and got the rectangular holes...

 

The above goes with the other reports on surface mode mesh tears and explosions. I normally never use any of the clean up methods under the voxel menu as they are still buggy. A new user would and not have a good impression of 3DC. Somewhere lingering in the Surface/LC code are a few very nasty bugs. Now since I used 3DCoat a long time, I know how to be careful in this mode to prevent most of them but a new user would not. These type of bugs are show stoppers and bad for 3DC in general even for me at times. I am starting to do most of my sculpting in voxels again as it affords a pleasant user experience even though that limits what I can do as far as details but I can go from voxels---retopo room---paintroom---blender without much of a headache.

Linux version 4.0.09 64 bit non-cuda beta...  "All bug fixes get rolled into the current beta hence that is the one I test"

post-518-0-32363300-1385499581_thumb.jpg

post-518-0-19086500-1385499593_thumb.jpg

Edited by digman

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i used

clean up memory never

 

first voxel mode for block modeling -never more than 1M-

- when the base model is ready to switch

1st step: to global space always

then  fill voids and close invisible hulls.

 

switch to sculpt mode and...

1st clean surface

 

this more or less preserve my workflow pretty well, but yes... new users cant get any idea about how models must be "build" to avoid any issues...

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