If I knew what I was doing with autotopologuy

[another666]

If I knew what I was doing wit autotopology tool what kind of polly count could I get this model down to ..

Just so I know what to aim for .. right now I am getting around 3000 quads 6000 tris

If I should be getting less than that or even could get less than that could some one show how I would mark up this model for autotop.

Thank you

err I can not edit my mis spelt heading

Edited March 13, 2013 by another666

[Daniel]

i'm not sure I understand you correctly... Do you need to make another AUTOPO but with different resulting polycount? If that's so, simply do everything that you did for the first time, but change the desired polycount from 3000 to 1000, for example. You'll just have another retopo layer in Retopo room

Take care!

[another666]

Sorry I should have asked

I am looking at low polly game assest creation, 3000 polly gives me a good looking mesh, but 3000 is too high a polly count, 1000 would be better but it produces a awfull mesh. If I draw out edge loops and draw strokes I mmore ofter than not produce a worse looking mesh than if I allowed 3Dcoat to do the work itself.

Are there any tricks to getting hard edges and low polly counts on the type of model I posted.

Thank you for any help with this ?

[Daniel]

I would retopo this manually! that way you have all the control!

But I would rather model that particular model in my 3D app with polys than doing it with voxels and then manually retopo (the geometry is not complex - do it in your 3D app)

[Gary Dave]

I've found that the Auto-topo does not handle hard surface meshes too well when dealing with low poly assets, not that I would really expect it to either to be honest. You're much better off doing the retopo manually, once you get used to the tools and work out the little tricks to them you're going to be better off.

Edit

D'oh, beaten to it!

[AbnRanger]

I've found that the Auto-topo does not handle hard surface meshes too well when dealing with low poly assets, not that I would really expect it to either to be honest. You're much better off doing the retopo manually, once you get used to the tools and work out the little tricks to them you're going to be better off.

Edit

D'oh, beaten to it!

That's right. Auto-Retopo is not ideal for every situation. It tries (by design) to give you evenly spaced quads, so if you try to set the number low, it's not going to have enough geometry to maintain the shape and stay evenly spaced. It takes some degree of experimentation to get a good result for the type of object you're modeling. I find it really nice when I have a bunch of secondary objects, like buttons, bracelets, belt's, etc. But if you want really clean geo, you want more control than what you're asking the algorithm to do.

If you use the Strokes tool as a starting point, sketch the topology the way you want, and hit ENTER. It's something of an Auto-Retopo tool, itself. That's why it's part of the Auto-Retopo toolset. You sketch the topology and use it's ability to make quick work of appendages, spherical, cylindrical and other primitive shapes. Then use the other tools to finish up some of the more tricky spots.

[another666]

Thank you for you repies

While I was playing with the autotopology tool I did manage to retop a qube so its mesh had 6 quads and 12 tris, though for the life in me I can not get it to do it again, I think this may have given me the wrong idea of what to expect from autotopology tools.

Thank you for you help

[Jax_Cavalera]

Is there a special location we can go to find clear step by step tutorials on how to use key features of the software such as the Autopo tool set as my trial download did not come with any manual and i've scoured the internet, forums etc for a clear :This is how you make a game asset in 3D Coat V4 starting from an imported hi-poly model and finishing with an exported low-res OBJ and matching normal map and texture map files.

 

It's very hard to determine if the software is worth putting money into when there is no quick way to start testing out it's features considering the short window of time we get to use the trial version.

 

My workflow is : Sculptris => 3D Coat => Blender  (or at least my intended workflow is that)

 

If I could find a good tutorial on using 3D Coat's sculpting features .. I may just throw that out the window too as I've been well impressed with the painting system.. it was quite smooth and offered a similar workflow as experienced in Sculptris.

 

But as a very low-on-coin indie games developer, just starting out.. the last thing a potential customer should be expected to do is shovel out extra cash to see instructional videos on how to use highlight features with narration or at the very least access to a text based tutorial that explains the workflow in easy to follow steps so that we can feel confident that this is the right software for purchasing.

 

At the moment, my attempts to follow old youtube tutorials have lead to software crash after software crash, which is likely due to trying to mix new features with old methods of workflow :S

[Carlosan]

This was not useful for you ?

https://www.youtube.com/user/PILGWAY3DCoat?feature=watch

 

which version are you using ?

 

regards

[Jax_Cavalera]

I'm using version 4 as per available from the website since the last 48 hours.  The video showcases a lot of the features, yes, however it doesn't show me how to properly use those features.  As someone that is new to a new software package, one of the biggest hurdles to get over is a brand new user interface and understanding how each function works and where they are located.

 

This requires either detailed text and graphic based tutorials (similar to what is free and available for Blender) or some narrated video tutorials where they display any shortcut/hotkey's being used so the viewer can follow those special moments where something goes not as expected and is then swiftly fixed by the person hosting the tutorial video.

 

The uncertainty for me is that unless I buy into these pay to learn tutorials so I can grasp the basic functionality of the software.. I won't know if the workflow is really for me in the first place and the whole point of a free trial is so that I can determine this without having to spend actual investment money into a product until I know the workflow and toolsets perform effortlessly like they appear to do in the youtube feature rundown video.

 

Don't get me wrong that feature rundown video has it's place.. it lets me know at a quick glance if the software even has a chance of being right for me, it just doesn't enable me to experience if it is the right software for me.  I don't know how many times i've seen a product promote a feature saying "and it just works" and then you give the trial a go with video tutorials.. and it just fails 50% of the time on the specific tasks you are wanting to apply the process towards as it has a very limited scope of usage with no real freedom to detour from that limited path.

[AbnRanger]

Is there a special location we can go to find clear step by step tutorials on how to use key features of the software such as the Autopo tool set as my trial download did not come with any manual and i've scoured the internet, forums etc for a clear :This is how you make a game asset in 3D Coat V4 starting from an imported hi-poly model and finishing with an exported low-res OBJ and matching normal map and texture map files.

 

It's very hard to determine if the software is worth putting money into when there is no quick way to start testing out it's features considering the short window of time we get to use the trial version.

 

My workflow is : Sculptris => 3D Coat => Blender  (or at least my intended workflow is that)

 

If I could find a good tutorial on using 3D Coat's sculpting features .. I may just throw that out the window too as I've been well impressed with the painting system.. it was quite smooth and offered a similar workflow as experienced in Sculptris.

 

But as a very low-on-coin indie games developer, just starting out.. the last thing a potential customer should be expected to do is shovel out extra cash to see instructional videos on how to use highlight features with narration or at the very least access to a text based tutorial that explains the workflow in easy to follow steps so that we can feel confident that this is the right software for purchasing.

 

At the moment, my attempts to follow old youtube tutorials have lead to software crash after software crash, which is likely due to trying to mix new features with old methods of workflow :S

 

I'm using version 4 as per available from the website since the last 48 hours.  The video showcases a lot of the features, yes, however it doesn't show me how to properly use those features.  As someone that is new to a new software package, one of the biggest hurdles to get over is a brand new user interface and understanding how each function works and where they are located.

 

This requires either detailed text and graphic based tutorials (similar to what is free and available for Blender) or some narrated video tutorials where they display any shortcut/hotkey's being used so the viewer can follow those special moments where something goes not as expected and is then swiftly fixed by the person hosting the tutorial video.

 

The uncertainty for me is that unless I buy into these pay to learn tutorials so I can grasp the basic functionality of the software.. I won't know if the workflow is really for me in the first place and the whole point of a free trial is so that I can determine this without having to spend actual investment money into a product until I know the workflow and toolsets perform effortlessly like they appear to do in the youtube feature rundown video.

 

Don't get me wrong that feature rundown video has it's place.. it lets me know at a quick glance if the software even has a chance of being right for me, it just doesn't enable me to experience if it is the right software for me.  I don't know how many times i've seen a product promote a feature saying "and it just works" and then you give the trial a go with video tutorials.. and it just fails 50% of the time on the specific tasks you are wanting to apply the process towards as it has a very limited scope of usage with no real freedom to detour from that limited path.

 

So, how many videos from the 3D Coat Youtube Channel have you watched?

Edited August 9, 2013 by AbnRanger

[Jax_Cavalera]

I have watched hmm is there a way to find the number easily?  I don't honestly know I didn't keep a running tally but I've been looking for tutorial videos from anywhere I can find them, not just exclusively the 3D Coat youtube channel.  I didn't even realize there was a 3D Coat channel until I was someway through the searching process.

 

I found 1 video more recently that shows a good workflow for the actual Texture Baking process which is really nice and I will be working my way through that one soon.  The only problem is that I can't find a linked tutorial for how they import into the software and set things up with retopology to arrive at that point.

 

I also haven't been able to find a secure way to remove single points from strokes that are being used to show Autopo where I want loops to flow as sometimes the strokes get too many points or connect to the wrong points and control clicking them has unpredictable results.  These are the sort of things that would be handy to locate in a to the point tutorial set.

 

I'm getting the sense that it's frowned upon to request this type of instructional content for free to better evaluate a product or am I reading that vibe wrong?  I understand that it would be unrealistic to expect instructional tutorials on using advanced workflows that combine features in a unique way as this is somewhat an individual's intellectual property or unique idea and I think it's great to find a way to profit from this and so they should.  The intended workflow however would be beneficial to sales and positive consumer response if it were clear and readily demonstrated.

[AbnRanger]

Did you check out Psionic's videos before posting here, or Greg's "Ghost Game Character" series in the Training Videos (General) playlist? How about the Common Workflow series in the Intro to 3D Coat playlist? There is a Retopo Playlist....lots and lots of videos to cover most aspects of 3D Coat. Leigh Bamforth has some inexpensive Retopo tutorials at www.Scary-monsters.org

 

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLlQ3JITh9bXM1jWm_zef5QiVebMReXqVL

 

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL603B0C27026099E3

 

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLlQ3JITh9bXOfcZqGuO8gClZisN6yUd1x

 

http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLF62F3C31216D2794

 

There are many different workflows in 3D Coat, because different people are going to use different tools for different tasks. Some just use 3D Coat to texture paint and do UV editing. Some just retopo. Some just model/sculpt in Voxels and immediately export for 3D Printing, rapid prototyping, or render for Graphic Design projects. There is no "one workflow fits all"

 

When all else fails, there is the tried and true RTFM.

Edited August 9, 2013 by AbnRanger

[Pix Jigsaw]

I would recommend the Ghost Game Character series, too.

[Jax_Cavalera]

Yeah that Ghost Game series you are both talking about is te one that I was doing too.  It was going great until my program kept crashing.  I figure it was trying to apply a texture to a mesh that had gaps in it.  After watching the UV tutorial further it shows how to UV a glove it shows the usage better and I will be able to put the pieces together

 

I was more trying to say that a single video series based on the currently available version of the software that does a run through from 

Part 1 : Things to consider when exporting / how to import a mesh into 3d Coat Vx

Part 2 : Using Retopo Tools with keystrokes and mouse clicks being used displayed or vocalized.

*wouldn't even need to do a lot just simply show where in the menu you go to access the tools and how they are used on a few poly's  or a small patch etc.. then show how to adjust things*

 

Part 3 : What to do with your retopo mesh ... Where to click or go or press so you can create a normal map etc.. 

 

Part 4 : Howe to bake this normal map onto the low poly retopo'd mesh and then a brief on painting.

 

Part 5 : Exporting .. what to do and how to ensure it can be opened up in software such as ... Blender or Maya or 3Ds Max

 

I wanna thank you guys for helping by providing the information and links to tutorials that you have.  I'll follow them and do my best.

[AbnRanger]

Yeah that Ghost Game series you are both talking about is te one that I was doing too.  It was going great until my program kept crashing.  I figure it was trying to apply a texture to a mesh that had gaps in it.  After watching the UV tutorial further it shows how to UV a glove it shows the usage better and I will be able to put the pieces together

 

I was more trying to say that a single video series based on the currently available version of the software that does a run through from 

Part 1 : Things to consider when exporting / how to import a mesh into 3d Coat Vx

Part 2 : Using Retopo Tools with keystrokes and mouse clicks being used displayed or vocalized.

*wouldn't even need to do a lot just simply show where in the menu you go to access the tools and how they are used on a few poly's  or a small patch etc.. then show how to adjust things*

 

Part 3 : What to do with your retopo mesh ... Where to click or go or press so you can create a normal map etc.. 

 

Part 4 : Howe to bake this normal map onto the low poly retopo'd mesh and then a brief on painting.

 

Part 5 : Exporting .. what to do and how to ensure it can be opened up in software such as ... Blender or Maya or 3Ds Max

 

I wanna thank you guys for helping by providing the information and links to tutorials that you have.  I'll follow them and do my best.

This may be especially helpful for baking multiple objects in the scene, in one shot. In most 3D applications, if I have a complex scene with multiple objects and try to use their Render to Texture utility, I can get a mess if I don't "Explode" the bake....meaning move all the parts away from each other, so that there is no overlapping parts to interfere with the raycasting. Or you would have to bake them separately. All of this can take a lot of time to do. The only way around it is to maybe use a plugin that automates the exploding process, for you. In 3ds Max, you have RTT Assist:

 

http://vertexbee.com/rttassist.htm

 

In 3D Coat, Andrew came up with an even more simplified method. Sequential Texture Baking, using Voxel Layer/Retopo Layer naming correspondence. I lobbied pretty hard for this feature, and believe me, it will save you a TON of time.

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJDNyLKGGaU&list=PL0614F2A03AD725CD&index=43

[Jax_Cavalera]

I forgot that I had previously watched the Game Character series on youtube and was asking these kind of questions back then :s I honestly can't believe I still haven't been able to get one good retop => bake with 3D Coat.  Maybe I need more sleep or something lol

[Aethyr]

Jax are you setting your cage up properly? When you go to bake it will ask you how far out and how far in you want to have the rays go to check for detail. Closest along normal is good for somethings but often times you need to manually add zones for models with lots of different depths in and out along the surface. It took a little getting used to but once I got the hang of it I am able to get some really nice bakes out every time. The setup is pretty easy just click add zone, set the min/max for that zone and the radius you want your zone to be.

[Jax_Cavalera]

Hi Aethyr,

Yes I was doing those things as you recommended.  The biggest issues were that the number of zones required to accurately deal with all the in and out depths was very high and also did not mirror so I had to do this for both sides.

 

I was not able to get the feet fixed so instead my character has flippers for feet.  I've seen other baked models with proper toes.. so I'm not really sure how they were able to do this and I could not but oh-well flipper boy is the best I can get right now.  I figure that it's simply a matter of adding extra V shaped quads between each toe.

 

I have got successful bakes now but it took a lot of experimenting to get there.  is there a chance that the spheres being added pre bake are able to be mirrored so you only have to set up one side optionally?

[Aethyr]

I'm not sure exactly what problem you are having when you say flipper boy. Do you mean that you are getting details from one toe on another toe in your bakes?

[Jax_Cavalera]

OH no sorry bout that .. that's just me trying to be comical about the situation   What I ended up having to do was to create a webbing between each toe so that the bake would have something to go inside of and outside of between toes.. I originally had it setup where the toes had a flat square shape like a box around each of them.. but when I would bake.. they would always come out munted.. wasn't able to get that quite right with the node spheres as they were too close together and in some cases just refused to play nice.

 

So... I then went for a box shape that encapsulated all toes with zero definition.. and this produced a lot of Black stuff where the inner and outer were clipping in the void between each toe on the reference mesh

 

so finally as a last dash effort to get it to work I resorted to changing the ref. mesh so that it had solid mesh between them for the baking process.