Applying fabric depth textures?

[popwfx]

I posted this here because I suspect this is easy and a newbie question, but how to do it in 3DCoat escapes me at present.

How would one apply a seamles fabric depth texture evenly over a surface based on the normal of the pixel on the surface while painting in the Paint Room?

At the moment I am using the Materials projection painting, but since that is tied to the camera viewport, I end up getting Moire patterns when applying the depth. Any hints on how to apply a seamless depth fabric texture (with fine details) over a curved surface? Something which wraps the depth around based on the shape of it? Ideally something that works with seamless textures too and won't leave seams if I scale up or down the texure before I paint.

[puntoit]

In the projecting dialog you can also define to use the cube map method. You will probably still get some unwanted areas but not as many. And the might be fixed using the view projecting method.

[AbnRanger]

I always like to use the 2D Texture Editor for tasks like this. But you could try the fill tool, where instead of using a procedural pattern, you can load an image file. It's for all kinds of things, like getting all the little dots on a football or basketball. If your UV's are good, the result should be, too.

[ajz3d]

Also, you can try image on spline tool, which works ok on simple cylinder-shaped surfaces like trousers legs, chest, arms. It's difficult to control though (especially the scale of control points) and requires several "passes".

If you get moiré when painting with projection, your tiles might be scaled down too much or camera too far away from the surface. Just guessing.

[popwfx]

Thanks everyone for the replies!

In the projecting dialog you can also define to use the cube map method. You will probably still get some unwanted areas but not as many. And the might be fixed using the view projecting method.

I missed this in the dropdown. Thanks! however, what do you mean about being "fixed using the view projecting method"?

I always like to use the 2D Texture Editor for tasks like this. But you could try the fill tool, where instead of using a procedural pattern, you can load an image file. It's for all kinds of things, like getting all the little dots on a football or basketball. If your UV's are good, the result should be, too.

Good idea, I seem to always forget about the 2D editing ability. I will try the fill tool as well. I think my UVs are good.

Also, you can try image on spline tool, which works ok on simple cylinder-shaped surfaces like trousers legs, chest, arms. It's difficult to control though (especially the scale of control points) and requires several "passes".

If you get moiré when painting with projection, your tiles might be scaled down too much or camera too far away from the surface. Just guessing.

I find it hard to control this tool. I like the visual feedback it gives, but it is very cylindrical, and it looks like the applied texture is getting pinched over the 90 degree areas (at the "caps" of the "cylinders"). I wish there was a tool like this, but it was a sphere with spline control points not a cylinder.

Here are my comparison tests with the generic sphere:

Looks like 2D Paint (assuming you have good UVs) and Paint with spline are the winners?? (in the Paint with Spline attempt I just did a closed curve around the "equator" of the sphere - so you can see pinching in the top "poles" of it). What do you guys think?

I'll attach the texture in case you can come up with a better method with a more even application.

fabric_depth.zip

[alvordr]

My first reaction to this was that your texture map was too low res.

[popwfx]

My first reaction to this was that your texture map was too low res.

Did you download the texture? it's 4K -- or do you mean that the resolution within the repeating pattern is too small? Assuming the texture was bigger, how do you apply this sort of thing easily and seamlessly over an irregular surface without Moire Patterns appearing? That may contribute to it, but I don't think the res of the depth texture is what is causing the moire stuff - is it?

[alvordr]

No. I didn't communicate this well. I meant to say that you didn't have enough subdivisions in your mesh to support the texture, but I could be wrong. That's what it looked like to me. I didn't mean to say that the texture was too low rez.

What you might consider is doing that texture work in the voxel room before baking, and then paint over it.

[popwfx]

No. I didn't communicate this well. I meant to say that you didn't have enough subdivisions in your mesh to support the texture, but I could be wrong. That's what it looked like to me. I didn't mean to say that the texture was too low rez.

What you might consider is doing that texture work in the voxel room before baking, and then paint over it.

Thank you for clarifying, unfortunately half of the time I'm not using voxels. A lot of times I'm using 3DCoat's power on externally created models. I gues sculpting is the primary use fo 3DC (despite the rest of the app being very strong) so I find most answers I get are from the sculpting perspective...

[alvordr]

That's likely because most people are using it for that, so I can't speak to it the way you're using it. Try importing the model as a voxel and seeing how it paints the fabric. I would put the voxel resolution up to at least 500k for this.

[popwfx]

That's likely because most people are using it for that, so I can't speak to it the way you're using it. Try importing the model as a voxel and seeing how it paints the fabric. I would put the voxel resolution up to at least 500k for this.

thanks, I appreciate the tip, but, If I did that, then I'm converting a poly model to voxels and giving me the headache of having to then retopo the new voxel model and also texturebake it. In this case, I don't want to add extra time-consuming steps to my workflow. If I'm in polys, I want to stay in polys (as in this case, I might just be using 3dc for painting or UV and don't want to re-jig everything - especially if I've already externally weighted the object or whatever)...

While this may be the case for many sculptors here (using 3DC as primarily a sculpting tool or as the sole tool to create content) I find because it plays nice with a lot of packages (like LW) you should be able to fit in 3DC's power whereever you want to at anytime in your workflow. If something I model and rig in LW or Modo or whatever needs UVs or texture painting, I can pull it in do what I need and pop it out. Not everybody creates every single thing exclusively in 3DC - especially if you are talking about dealing with existing assets.

But that being said, I will get more into sculpting in 3DC when the project demands it, and then all these voxel only tips will finally come in handy ;-)

[Tony Nemo]

You can reuse your original mesh in Retopo for conventional heads where proportions and features are reasonably close. Just import the mesh and snap it to the new model.

[Tony Nemo]

Has anyone used a fabric stencil or PBR without moire patterns appearing? Close up, everything normal. Back up and you get moire and rotate to get flickering. 

I've tried every approach (painting on the Texture Editor) but for painting on the Normal map in PS. Never mind getting the scale right.

[ajz3d]

1 hour ago, Tony Nemo said:

Has anyone used a fabric stencil or PBR without moire patterns appearing? Close up, everything normal. Back up and you get moire and rotate to get flickering. 

I've tried every approach (painting on the Texture Editor) but for painting on the Normal map in PS. Never mind getting the scale right.

This is usually taken care of by mip-maps, pixel/texture filtering or anti-aliasing in the target renderer.

At worst case scenario scale up the pattern, which from what I read you already did.

[digman]

Like Ajz3d said, in your target renderer it should not be a problem.

[Tony Nemo]

Thanks, guys! Actually, I had to scale it down to fit the pants.

[Henry Townshend]

This is still missing in 2023. 3D Coat has no Mip Mapping inside its view port. Having to export and go outside the app to estimate your higher frequency detailed textures looks is not a good nor efficient solution. Plus it makes estimation of crisp normal map details difficult, with the tendency to tune it down in coat and then be surprised why its to toned down inside other apps. A texture app should offer users an accurate preview of how textures will look in other apps/engines.

I have written Andrew several times to maybe consider integrating Mip Maps. For a texturing app, this is a huge oversight imo. Every single application or game outside of 3D Coat uses it. Having Mip Mapping inside a texturing view port is essential. Has been for ages.