Jump to content
3DCoat Forums
ajz3d

AJ's doodley doodles

Recommended Posts

oh la la !

 

this piece of art is shinning man ! :blink:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey, thank you guys! :blush:

 

Another update. Completed barrels and some engravings on various objects. The only things remaining to do are a decorated clip that joins two innermost barrels and some missing screws here and there.

 

When I was sculpting layers in isolation mode, I didn't pay too much attention to overall polycount of the scene. Turns out it reached 97M! Ludicrous! I better decimate it before my computer explodes, ha ha! :rofl:

Nevertheless, it's good to know that 3DC is capable of working with such numbers.

 

wip7.jpg?dl=1

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, you should be able to get that down to a few million polys.  I've only taken it to about 56 million before I got scared and backed off.  Normally, I go no higher than a few million, max.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, you should be able to get that down to a few million polys.  I've only taken it to about 56 million before I got scared and backed off.  Normally, I go no higher than a few million, max.

In the end I went down from 100 million to 27 million. A huge boost in performance with little-to-no quality loss. B)

 

Sculpture is completed. Time to move to retopo room.

 

Front:

 

wip_sculpture_front.jpg?dl=1

 

And side:

 

wip_sculpture_side.jpg?dl=1

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wow! That's really cool! If the bullets don't get you, then probably the harpoon will. :)

I like your signature in the corner too!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks again guys.

 

Wow! That's really cool! If the bullets don't get you, then probably the harpoon will. :)
I like your signature in the corner too!

David Cushman (http://www.dave-cushman.net/shot/ducksfoot.html) wrote that it "is a thin barbed blade that can come into play after the pistol has been discharged". No indication to whether it's fixed in place or not. But I like your idea of a harpoon very much, especially if it could be fired too. :)
 

If you have it it in Voxel mode and reduce the scale, you're counts will go down.

Actually I had to scale my VoxTree up at one point because I ran into some problems that popped up due to the fact that I began sculpting in a far too small scale (camera clipping and brushing issues). Fortunately, when voxel layers contain geometry, they do not increase their density on scale transformations. Otherwise, It would surely clog my CPU. :)
Anyway, I try convert my layers to surfaces as soon as I'm fairly sure I won't be performing any more boolean operations on them.


I did some retopo work yesterday. About half of the model is done, mostly large surfaces like butt, barrels, some brass decorations and half of crocodile. I'd like to keep its polycount around 20,000 triangles and will use three 20482 UV-sets, one for each material: wood, brass and steel. I plan to prepare textures using a combination of 3D Coat's paint room and custom networks in Substance Designer.
 
Here are some initial experiments performed on existing retopo mesh (I hope the image isn't too dark). Texture definition on final brass and steel textures will probably be slightly lower from what can be observed on the image, because there are still many elements sharing these two materials that I have not retopologised yet.
 
retopo_tex_01.jpg?dl=1

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Friends,

 

Looks like I ran into a problem...

 

I've always been doing almost exclusively SubDiv models (mostly with retopo shapes already predefined), so doing retopo work for games is something relatively new to me. That said I might not know every caveat a game modeller should know, though I read some stuff at Polycount's Wiki to boost my knowledge a bit in this department. It turns out it wasn't enough.

 

So, the problem.

 

I already retopologised  a lot of my model and most of the objects seem to bake to lo-poly quite okay, however I have trouble with the frizzen. It may seem it has a very simple shape, and there were more complex components of the gun that baked just fine, but with this one I cannot get acceptable results. The normal map of the cylindrical part bakes with ugly radial stripes. There are also some artefacts on the thin side of the mesh when normal map is applied to it.

What might have caused this?

I can upload both hi- and lo-poly meshes for inspection if necessary.

 

ugly_bake.jpg?dl=1

Edited by ajz3d

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for the links Carlos, but I don't have problems with UV seams. It's the shading caused by either - the normal map or by my retopo mesh that troubles me.

Edited by ajz3d

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

the Lo-poly pic (at right) show the uv islands in different colors ?

 

try less edges, in the pivot, in the cylinder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If I press '6' in the paint room to display the so-called 'med-poly' mesh (which is exactly the same as a lo-poly mesh in this case - because of no subdivision applied to retopo mesh on baking), I get no artifacts at all (at least not those that I should pay attention to). But the normal map 3DC saves to file contains them. So I'm a little bit confused here. What exactly is going on here?

 

hi-med_poly_comparison.jpg?dl=1

Edited by ajz3d

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hard to say.  If I get weird bake errors like that, I either:

 

1)  Bake with different inner/outer cage and bake method

2)  Redo my topology in those areas

3)  Choose a different material in the Voxel Room for the object prior to baking

4)  Use another version of 3DC, I keep the 3.x version always at hand for that very reason

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for suggestions, Robert.

#1 - I tried, but to no avail.

#2 - I'm not sure what else I can do here. The cap of the cylinder that causes me trouble is a flat plane with some spans. What can I do here to further improve the retopo mesh without excessively increasing poly count?

#3 - I use the Default material which always worked in the past. I tried with other materials with the same result.

#4 - I'm not sure if it would work. Especially when xNormal returns me similar crap. I guess it must be something with the retopo mesh.

 

The files are here to download for some kind soul that would like to inspect or experiment with them:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/9r4bi0iopz6dcbl/frizzen_files.7z?dl=1

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Are any of those other normals somehow flipped?  I doubt that's it, as they're rendering, just not well.  If not, try adding a span down the middle of one of those problem areas and see if that fixes it in that area.  Otherwise, I'm running out of ideas, other than to take a look at it.

 

One question...how critical is it that you have that particular geometry?

 

EDIT:  Doing my own retopo against that model by hand took about 5 min and baked just fine.  Granted the geometry I created is lower than what you had, as it's often my area to do game-ready pieces, but the bake should work just as well with increased geometry.  I'm going to take a look at it with your retopo mesh next.

 

EDIT:  Yours results in pure black, which means my bake settings are wrong for that retopo mesh.  I adjusted down to 1 (inner) and 3 (outer), but it still wasn't right.  The time it will take to figure out the right settings probably isn't worth it vs retopoing it again.

 

My suggestion is to retopo it again.  I've done it twice and it baked well the first time, the second time I had to adjust a couple of things, but the retopo was aimed at being more like what you had before.

Edited by alvordr
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Look first image

 

set:

Merge into scene = microverts

 

 

O.K. after a few hours of trial and error I got some fairly good results using a low poly retopo mesh (5k triangles). Using the Baking settings of "Scan inside/outside the object" set to 1.2, using the "Snap to outer surface" method and adding a few zones with their depth set to 2.0 over areas which were not captured, (BTW a mirror support would help a lot with adding zones to a symmetrical mesh). I then used "Merge into scene (microverts)" and selected the lowest Carcass resolution with 20 million for the hi rez map. I had to do quite a bit of smoothing though and the exported displacement map didn't hold all the details as what was in the view port.

 

It seems that the culprit is my UV map, The area where I am getting problems on the mesh is rather reduced on the UV map, so I think I will have to take better care of my UV real-estate, it appears that if you don't have a large enough UV area, when the displacement map is created, you will get a transparent area with floating checkered pattern there instead of a map and no matter what you do you cannot fix this unless you give that area more UV space.

 

and

 

http://3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=10707&p=83078

 

:D

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thank you for your time, friends. I appreciate your help.

 

I think the problem is solved, although I did not suspect this kind of a solution.

 

Here's what I did.

 

First, I tried baking normal map from Carlos' scene using the microverts path. But the exported normal map, while looking pretty decent in the paint room, when imported into Substance Designer turned out to be full of artefacts.
post-12523-0-69004300-1407108342_thumb.j

Then, following Robert's advice I tried to add some edge loops and noticed that inserting them very close to inner and outer UV seams of a cylinder completely eliminates those ugly radial shading artefacts. But the cost of this operation was very high because it would add a lot of unnecessary geometry. So I thought that it would be a good idea to follow Robert's other advice - making a new retopo mesh.

I started with a simple plane and noticed that it bakes perfectly. Then I made a flat cylinder's cap and this baked very well too. But once I started to connect both cylinder caps from the outside, artefacts began to emerge on bakes. When I connected the inside, the mess was complete - the very same artefacts appeared that I had on bakes from my original retopo mesh.

Then I recalled some article I once read that explained how to fix shading errors on a game mesh. It was something to do with manually triangulating offending faces. So I triangulated all faces of cylinder's cap and voila, the cap baked without any of those friggin stripes.

post-12523-0-88691600-1407110088_thumb.j

And the best thing is, that with the newest beta version of 3D Coat (4.1.11A) I don't even have to manually triangulate the mesh before baking because Andrew added support for triangulation. This, from what I understand, triangulates the retopo mesh only for the time of baking and according to algorithm selected by user. "Simplest" triangulation works very well with Substance Designer (it's intended to be used with Unity). I didn't try Delaunay with SD yet, but in 3D Coat it bakes perfectly too.

post-12523-0-26344300-1407110140_thumb.j
 

Edited by ajz3d
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×