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digman
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  • 2 weeks later...
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For anyone who's interested, a new implementation of subsurface scattering in cycles. A better one. 

You'll find it in newer official builds.

 http://builder.blender.org/download/

Here some tests, the whole thread is chaotic but explains many new things. Impossible to read all these pages. But I was tuned to it, from the first day of cycles. This is how I learned this renderer. You won't find good tuts around. Most of them are simply nonsenses. 

http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?216113-Brecht-s-easter-egg-surprise-Modernizing-shading-and-rendering&p=2459893&viewfull=1#post2459893

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Ok, the link is working now. Maybe it just took some time for it to update onto the 3D-Coat server...

 

Thanks for sharing this Michalis! That is an amazing Cycles render! Very realistic. How did he do that? What would the node tree for that look like?

 

Oh, and in the thread they are talking about Prometheus...I loved that movie. Many people disliked it (mostly because of so-called issues with the plot), but I think it was very entertaining. I liked the way the Engineers looked too. They were aliens, so of course their SSS didn't look "realistic". I thought their style (and the whole artistic style of the movie) was pretty cool!

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Thanks Beat, 

LOL, 

Indeed I stared a whole blender thread on such workarounds, after a debate on the prometheus movie. 

It goes the opposite way. Bake first, UV unwrap after. Sculpt by UVs and displacements. 

http://blenderartists.org/forum/showthread.php?273033-Sculpting-with-UVs-and-displacements&p=2245866&viewfull=1#post2245866

3dcoat can't do this. But, it can do the most important part of it, to sculpt a geometrical relief and bake displacements on a single quad. 

http://3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=12787&p=92071

The rest can take place on a typical 3d app/renderer. 

 

BTW

CG Awards 2013, winners. 3d world. 

http://www.3dworldmag.com/2013/09/05/cg-awards-2013-winners/

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Just thought I would jump into this thread. I just decided last week to have another bash at Blender. Almost gave up after a couple of days! But stuck with it for the week,I am glad I did , it is all a lot clearer now and I have gained a bit of excitement back for my cg endeavers. I am still putting off figuring out the nodes. I copied some of the setups from above in the thread and I hope they will help me....be prepared for questions.

My main task for now is to take  a 3dcoat model ( image map, normal map and spec map) into Blender and use cycles.

   I got cheesed off with Daz and what they are doing with Carrara, and an expensive point upgrade with nothing I use improved was the last straw. Cripes ,Ive already made an ocean,a fluffy cloud and a falling napkin! And dare I say it, Blender kicks a**!

And it works with my new Space Navigator I bought with the cash I did not spend on Carrara!

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More. Please ?

(I contemplated participating in the throne challenge with a giger theme btw)

Ha ha, I just realized that Michalis' Giger-themed sculpt looks like a rib cage, and so does my throne for the challenge thread, LOL!

 

Have a look:

http://3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=14990&page=3

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Prometheus movie was entertaining indeed. However, some scenes were not of the same quality as some other amazing ones. 

Perhaps its time for the Prometheus contest. 

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Perhaps its time for the Prometheus contest. 

According to the rules, the winner of the 3D-Coat Challenge gets to choose the topic for the next Challenge. If you win, you can choose a Prometheus theme if you want. I will definitely participate for that one!

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image map, normal map and spec map

 

Just reminding: normal maps and spec maps as NonColorData. 

The specmap, probably this way.

How it works? This second mix shader, spec maps B&W image is connected as value, allows all the light areas to pass as glossy, the dark areas won't work so. A curve may needed for fine tuning. 

If you connect the spec to the first socket of the mix node, it will do the opposite. So, many use a invert node. No needed, just connect it to the second socket. 

You may think of them as filters. 

If we use a color specmap, well, connect it as color to the glossy BSDF. 

 

To have an idea of how advanced this node system is: 

A color spec map can be split into three RGB nodes. You may add offset parameters to these RGB values, driving more complicated setups. 

Now, it starts looking like a code... in blender community we start calling them noodles (LOL) 

post-2454-0-23132800-1378557139_thumb.jp

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As Mr Spock used to say, it is logical. 

A B&W map can always be used as a value. To control a logical filter. 

 

You can always rename nodes, by entering the N panel under nodes editor. I renamed the tex map as spec map. I hope it wasn't confusing. 

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Yes I did get confused ...I spent ages looking for the spec map node!

 

LOL

I mean, sorry. I was afraid of it. I had similar issues with posted setups in the past. 

 

Select any node you like, N for the right N panel, you can rename it. 

Or, select a few nodes. go to nodes menu (down there) ctrl+J mean join them into a frame. On the N panel again, you can rename it or colorize it. Nice tips for presentations. 

Post any question you may have, glad to help. 

Or, maybe, I should post some simple setups. 

 

The most confusing for newcomers is the real displacement setup in blender. 

In the near future real displacement will take place inside cycles (devs are working on this, probably based on the pixar subd algorithm). This is why you already see a displacement socket on output. Don't use it, it is under development. 

 

I also have a question related to 3dcoat. 

 

1. I have a sculpted mesh (voxel room)

2. I did retopo it, UV unwrapped it. 

 

The goal is: to bring it to blender, subdivide it at level 3, add real displacements. For the hi freq details I will add a normal map. 

So, I have to directly bake a disp map in 3dcoat. OK, 

However, I need to bake a normal map after 3 subdivisions. If I use the default n-map in blender, on top of a real displaced mesh, the results will be rather ugly and unnatural. 

 

What's the best way to go? 

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Cycles SSS is still under heavy development and it uses almost the same approach and algorithms as in Arnold. 

Vray SSS is better organized. So far. 

If you don't have multiple maps (epidermal, subdermal etc ) to use, you might prefer cycles already. 

Most people when they are talking about SSS, they mean human skin mostly. 

Cycles, so far, tend to produce a bit blurry effects (a little more than expected from SSS). We're experimenting and working on this. 

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Carrara is a lot simpler in my opinion.After my experience this week the shader set up is a doddle...no nodes Im afraid just a nice simple stack with a continuous update window.Really easy hair tool and its not bad looking if you do it right.

Its horses for courses as they say.Its what fits you best.I was hoping to use cycles to render my latest project because I wanted it to look better than the Carrara render .( I think it is pretty good anyway,but wanted to go to the next level.) But it turned out to be a massive ball ache.to get it 3 percent better....but as I didnt know what I was really doing it wasnt turning out better.But I am glad I explored Blender a bit  because all the dynamic stuff in Carrara is rubbish really, compared to blender.I think I will be using Blender in the future for cloth draping, smoke,fire. water .From my limited tests they look great.To be honest the only thing I use C for is render and hair,That is why I didnt get the current upgrade because thes two things wernt touched.I spent a lot of time looking at the blender galleries, and I am pretty sure there was nothing that could not be emulated in carrara. They are just tools,whichever fits your hand and brain the best...Use that one.

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The most confusing for newcomers is the real displacement setup in blender. 

In the near future real displacement will take place inside cycles (devs are working on this, probably based on the pixar subd algorithm). This is why you already see a displacement socket on output. Don't use it, it is under development. 

 

I also have a question related to 3dcoat. 

 

1. I have a sculpted mesh (voxel room)

2. I did retopo it, UV unwrapped it. 

 

The goal is: to bring it to blender, subdivide it at level 3, add real displacements. For the hi freq details I will add a normal map. 

So, I have to directly bake a disp map in 3dcoat. OK, 

However, I need to bake a normal map after 3 subdivisions. If I use the default n-map in blender, on top of a real displaced mesh, the results will be rather ugly and unnatural. 

 

What's the best way to go? 

It would be very kind of you if you would please post a setup on how to do real displacement in Blender. I've been trying to figure that out.

 

Second, how are you baking displacement in 3D-Coat? I still don't know how to do this properly. So sorry I can't help you with your question...

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OK

Here's a small tutorial. on displacements. Always valid and the only we have so far.

(Soon you'll be able to apply disp easier in the cycles node editor. Still experimental and works with procedural tex only. It discards UVs, please avoid it.) 

Displacements are happening in real geometry, nothing to do with cycles so far. However, you can always ask for different subd density on 3dpreview and the renderer. You have a few on preview and as much as your memory can handle on the render. For CUDA Cycles users, keep in mind, there is a limitation, depends on your Vram. 

(the posted images, well they came the wrong order sorry)  (so, backwards)

DispTut1:

1, Add a subsurf modifier, 2. a displacement modifier

Your 3dview mesh will become an extruded thing, Don't panic LOL

DispTut2: 

I had UV unwrap before these, you will obviously import the mesh from 3dcoat so, skip it. Just demonstrating the wonderful "follow active quad" UV blender method. 

DispTut3

Go to the texture properties panel (this with the read and white grid icon) 

Under the drop down menu, select displacement. (It appears there, after you have an active displacement modifier) 

DispTut4

Under texture, type (of tex dropdown menu) is ImageOrMovie.

DispTut5

ImputColorSpace is NonColorData, for exr 32 bit or B&W tifs 16 bit. Never use 8 bit images for displacements. 

 

As you do all these, try not to panic with what you see in the 3dviewport! LOL

 

DispTut6

Back in the modifiers panels

Displ modifier, texture coordinates = UV !

 

DispTut7

Almost finished. Fine tuning now. 

1. try one or two more subdivisions to have a preview. (depending on your hardware, ask as much you can handle maintaining 3dviewport performance. You can ask as many you like in the render value

2. the MidLevel is the midvalue (the grey tone) as in 3dcoat exporters. The strength of the displacement as you like. A 0.1 or 0.2, but it is possible up to 1 (depends on the app you used for baking) 

On the top of the blender window, watch the density of the mesh as you add subs in the ViewPort. Watch the memory consumption too. This gonna be different under cycles render though. (lower probably) 

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