philnolan3d Posted December 2, 2008 Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 I'm not sure exactly what "subtools" means. I know I've heard it when playing with maya or something and will probably say "oh right, that!" when it's explained, if someone would be kind enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member BluEgo Posted December 2, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 2, 2008 Subtool handling is pretty obvious, but important. I really don't know how you can do that with voxels, but I hope you can bring something together... even if it's just a (reasonably high quality) poly approximation of the inactive tools -- just something to let you know what you're working with. Being able to localize the detail would be great. In the above sketch I don't have much to work with in the face area, but if I go to the next level it's too heavy (it would be workable for final details, but I still need to shape out the face etc). Perhaps there is already a way around that I'm not aware of? I second these two requests. I am so glad Andrew you are working on subtools ! Maybe it would be nice having a combination of the two, having the chance to sculpt on two subtools at the same time, in the contact areas. So I could have more resolution on one voxel tool, but with a smooth transition to the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member jedwards Posted December 3, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 3, 2008 Phil: subtools is just zbrush terminology for multiple meshes in the same file. A single Ztl file can hold one or more subtools or meshes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted December 3, 2008 Report Share Posted December 3, 2008 Ah Thank you. Same thing as LightWave Modeler's layers. Edit: I almost forgot... "oh right, that!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted December 9, 2008 Contributor Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 I've been playing around with the alpha for a while now and I can say without a single doubt that this soft is going to be the most powerful sculpting solution and allaround tool ever. I just can't believe how fast it is growing. Anyway...I'm a very experienced 3d sculptor and I'm super deep in both zbrush and mudbox2009 and here are the things I think would greatly improve the sculpting freedom and power of the already superpowerful 3dcoat. Curves: -multibranching of curves(I've red you're workin on it : AWESOME!) also being able to add many curves all around(even over each others) and being able to press enter AFTER so they get all the same height or even negative height -being able to substract with curves (maybe it's possible already but I donlt know how:please tell me) -drawing of closed shapes with curves General sculpting: -being able to substract with the flatten surface tool (very important for efficient hardsurface work) -and also being able to add and substract with the Vox pinch tool(pinch in and out)-for wrinkles and clothes -a new setting for the soft stroke so we can make straigter less wiggly drags -being able to cut at various depths with the lasso and polygonal selection(didn't found how to do it) -transpose-subtools(already working on it great) Texturing: -a one click button that would copy a color or depth layer from on side to another across the symmetry plane (meaning without having to paint it all with the clone tool) -a new curve based gradient for the Cube mapping (if curve gradient not possible,3 points gradient at least) It's already so much powerful,but those few little things would greatly improve my workflow. I just can't wait to see what you'll come up with.It's very exciting to see this amazing software grow. edit:I just realised the last suggestion wasn't related to voxel sculpting,sorry Cheers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted December 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 Welcome! -multibranching of curves(I've red you're workin on it : AWESOME!)also being able to add many curves all around(even over each others) and being able to press enter AFTER so they get all the same height or even negative height Press "Add curve" in curves tool and you can add as many curves as you need. Every curve has profile, size per node. Curves can share single vertex and be self-intersecting. -being able to substract with curves (maybe it's possible already but I donlt know how:please tell me) CTRL+ENTER -drawing of closed shapes with curves It will be done anyway because it very powerful shape-making method. -being able to substract with the flatten surface tool (very important for efficient hardsurface work) There is scrape tool. -and also being able to add and substract with the Vox pinch tool(pinch in and out)-for wrinkles and clothes Use CTRL -a new setting for the soft stroke so we can make straigter less wiggly drags Not done but planned. -being able to cut at various depths with the lasso and polygonal selection(didn't found how to do it) Use 'E' panel but really it should be improved. -transpose-subtools(already working on it great) Transpose is done, subtools - 80% Texturing:-a one click button that would copy a color or depth layer from on side to another across the symmetry plane (meaning without having to paint it all with the clone tool) There is Topology symmetry tool. It makes exactly what you have told. It is like tangent symmetry in Mudbox. -a new curve based gradient for the Cube mapping (if curve gradient not possible,3 points gradient at least) That is interesting and not hard to do. Do you mean Y-axis - along curve, x,y - orthogonal to Y? And thanks for kind words! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member ldzywsj Posted December 9, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 It will be done anyway because it very powerful shape-making method. Andrew,do you mean you have a plan to improve the 2d-paint tool to what shapeshop and any other comparable apps act as? That would be great! I think now the base shape-making method should be improved! And I prefer the 2d-paint tool to improve to a sketch-Based base shape-making tool. Here are some interesting video about sketch-based shape-making apps! http://www.shapeshop3d.com/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted December 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 Andrew,do you mean you have a plan to improve the 2d-paint tool to what shapeshop and any other comparable apps act as?That would be great! I think now the base shape-making method should be improved! And I prefer the 2d-paint tool to improve to a sketch-Based base shape-making tool. Here are some interesting video about sketch-based shape-making apps! http://www.shapeshop3d.com/ It will be close in some way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted December 9, 2008 Contributor Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 Wow ,half of the things I wished are already there!! curves: thanx for the tip now adding and mixing curves works great. ...but sometimes when I try to bridge 2 points the program doesn't let me do it. scrape: I just found out that to me the scrape tool seems to work only with the mouse, this is why I wasn't able to see how great it is the first times. When I use the pen it really act weird even if I toggle off the pen pressure button (like melting with a flame) pinching in and out: Vox Pinch with +ctrl is giving me strange results. I don't think I understand what it is doing. What I want is to do is pinch in and out.(like combining the extrude tool with the vox pinch tool maybe) That would mean that if I would use it with the soft stroke on a flat surface it would carve in a nice wrinkle.This is one of zbrush most powerful features. cubic mapping: along a x,y curve the user could draw would be great! thanx again, I'll try to post a few voxel wonders before Christmas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted December 9, 2008 Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 -drawing of closed shapes with curves It will be done anyway because it very powerful shape-making method. Uh, this is already done. Just hit the "Closeness" button. BTW Andrew, that name doesn't make any sense, "Closed" would be better. "Closeness" refers to the distance between two things, how close they are to each other. BTW I just made an example of Subtracting with Curves if you see my Misato Katsuragi VS WIP, the lines in her dress were done with this method (see the latest version at the bottom of the thread). http://3dbrush.kriska.hvosting.net/forum/i...?showtopic=1921 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted December 9, 2008 Author Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 Uh, this is already done. Just hit the "Closeness" button. BTW Andrew, that name doesn't make any sense, "Closed" would be better. "Closeness" refers to the distance between two things, how close they are to each other. I mean curve with filled hole inside curve. I remember your dragon and discussion around this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted December 9, 2008 Report Share Posted December 9, 2008 I mean curve with filled hole inside curve. I remember your dragon and discussion around this Ah yes, OK that would be nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member wailingmonkey Posted December 10, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 10, 2008 Transpose is done, subtools - 80% Andrew, Are you allowing for the option to (or not to) transpose multiple voxel 'subtools' simultaneously? This has been one frustration with zbrush in that transposing your 'main' subtool worked just fine, but if you wanted to transpose all subtools in the selected area, only 1 would work. (it's since been addressed by the Pixologic folks with workaround script, but it's not an ideal solution) I'd love to see the ability to toggle 'transpose'-ability on and off when posing voxel sculpts with multiple subtools ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member geo_n Posted December 10, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 10, 2008 It will be done anyway because it very powerful shape-making method.Uh, this is already done. Just hit the "Closeness" button. BTW Andrew, that name doesn't make any sense, "Closed" would be better. "Closeness" refers to the distance between two things, how close they are to each other. BTW I just made an example of Subtracting with Curves if you see my Misato Katsuragi VS WIP, the lines in her dress were done with this method (see the latest version at the bottom of the thread). http://3dbrush.kriska.hvosting.net/forum/i...?showtopic=1921 I think the shape tools pointed out was the same as the youtube link. it looks very interesting and fast. btw, where's the closeness button in voxel curves? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted December 10, 2008 Report Share Posted December 10, 2008 btw, where's the closeness button in voxel curves? Right here. It doesn't appear until after you've started a Curve. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted December 11, 2008 Report Share Posted December 11, 2008 Request: When working on dense models I do a lot of hiding. It would be nice if you could assign a hot key to the Unhide and Invert Hide buttons. You actually can do it already, but you have to be already using the Hide tool or the hot key doesn't do anything. The point of the hot key would be so that we don't have to keep hitting the Hide tool in order to Unhide or Invert. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted December 11, 2008 Contributor Report Share Posted December 11, 2008 I'm just posting this because I'm sure it's easy to do. When you set the brush radius above 50(like 150) it would be good that when you try to go down with the slider it didn't go back down instantly to 50 and expand the slider to 0-150 instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member GED Posted December 12, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 12, 2008 Request: this might be a little unnecessary so feel free to ignore but it could be really useful if it works well. Im thinking Voxel sculpting is great but we need a way to quickly lay down a fairly good base shape to sculpt on. So heres what I imagine, you select non voxel primitives and move, rotate and scale them into position in the viewport to create the basic silouette. Then just like curves you hit enter and it all turns into voxels and blends together a little to create one big voxel shape. The same thing is possible now but we would have to arrange the primitives in a seperate 3D app and then import as obj as you can see with the yoshi made of spheres in this thread http://boards.polycount.net/showthread.php...5268&page=4 the sphere tool currently in 3D coat is good but its more like a brush and really difficult to use it to make a base shape as you dont really know where the sphere will appear in 3D space. edit: actually this might not work well with symettry so that wouldnt be so useful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member NinjaTaco Posted December 12, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 12, 2008 Request: this might be a little unnecessary so feel free to ignore but it could be really useful if it works well. Im thinking Voxel sculpting is great but we need a way to quickly lay down a fairly good base shape to sculpt on. So heres what I imagine, you select non voxel primitives and move, rotate and scale them into position in the viewport to create the basic silouette. Then just like curves you hit enter and it all turns into voxels and blends together a little to create one big voxel shape. The same thing is possible now but we would have to arrange the primitives in a seperate 3D app and then import as obj as you can see with the yoshi made of spheres in this thread http://boards.polycount.net/showthread.php...5268&page=4 the sphere tool currently in 3D coat is good but its more like a brush and really difficult to use it to make a base shape as you dont really know where the sphere will appear in 3D space. edit: actually this might not work well with symettry so that wouldnt be so useful I like the yoshi example. There might be something useful to roughing shapes out in such a way... One of the things that troubles me when making a cartoony shape is maintaining the continuous curvature that you see on the yoshi nose to the eyes and so on. But something like the requested feature might actually be available tommorow with the addition of subtools. That is of course if all goes according to plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member GED Posted December 13, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 13, 2008 I found out that there is already something similar to what I described in 'merge - transform' but that only lets you move rotate and scale one object at a time and then when its set in voxels you cant move or rotate or scale it anymore. I want to move a large collection of primitives around in the viewport and then hit enter and get them to all turn to voxels at once. At the moment I have to place them one at a time and just hope I got the proportions/angles or position right because they are then voxels and cant be changed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member NinjaTaco Posted December 13, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 13, 2008 I dunno if this asked for... It'd be nice to have radial symmetry similar to zbrush. Another thing. I like some of the column and row masking tools in zbrush but they do have some issues. I was thinking that in 3dc, you could have a free pen mode or spline mode where the user draws a line on the object and a mask of rows or columns is projected along the surface. It could create the masked row by making the projected lines perpendicular to the drawn line. Either that or maybe just a few more options for transpose cause transpose almost behaves like a masking tool and the gizmo selection stuff is pretty fun, I really like ring. Perhaps there could be an inflate tool that could be added to the transpose tools. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted December 16, 2008 Contributor Report Share Posted December 16, 2008 A very simple thing:a button to bring the model back to the center of the world(position and rotation) (it VERY important without this retopology of vox tree subobjects cannot be done with symmetry.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor tree321 Posted December 17, 2008 Contributor Report Share Posted December 17, 2008 Repeat stroke.This is important for greater accuracy when sculpting. http://www.veoh.com/videos/v16947068NMFjChyW Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member NinjaTaco Posted December 18, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 18, 2008 Needs more speed. I'm curious to know whether it's possible to make scalable voxels? In some ways voxels are really helping out a lot but in other ways, voxels are also slowing things down it seems. I think it'd be good if there was some kind of hybrid mode. I see in the wireframe that the topology on the mesh I'm working on is always being adjusted. Sometimes I don't need the topology to be adjusted, I just need to push and pull some areas of the mesh around and it becomes counterproductive when I have to allow it to recalculate the topology and voxels and whatever else it is doing. There needs to be some kind of mode for refining the surface. Yet there also still needs to be a way to go back into voxel mode if needed, so that flexibility is maintained. It seems like this idea has been played with some concerning the pinch and flatten tools. Maybe there could a be a hybrid mode where the software adjusts topology when needed, maybe it could have some kind of adjustable threshold for when it rebuilds the mesh versus just pushing and pulling points about. Also there needs to be a way to do local subdivision. Kind of like this http://www.zbrush.info/docs/index.php/Local_Subdivision Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member wailingmonkey Posted December 18, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 18, 2008 tree321, I'm in agreement. (http://3dbrush.kriska.hvosting.net/forum/i...p?showtopic=633) shhh :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Mantis Posted December 18, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 18, 2008 -some request, Hope this is easy to do. That would be nice to be able to extrude from a spline shape. You draw a shape with the spline tool like you do for creating hole. Than you extrude it with a custom value. Adding a bevel to it would be really nice too. Like that you have your extrude shape with a nice bevel around it. Getting a Stroke from line, like the stroke path in photoshop but with sculpting. You draw a line on your shape, hit Stroke from line, and Tada you got a perfect stroke. The best would be to have a stroke who depend on your alpha, once again like photoshop with brush shape, like that you can do whaetever you want. I suggest this because that can be very handy, I made a test a while before to sculpt totally in Zbrush a futuristic armor. I used mask for the shape on the stomach the ribs and so on and freehand stroke for the hollow that you can see all around. If you add these kind of feature I'm sure I could do this armor totally inside 3DCoat and with less time and a even better Here is the armor I'm talking about: While watching again this picture, I think that a smooth area and a way to make perfect hole is needed too. For the three hole in triangle I used a simple alpha in sub mode, I don't know if there is a way to do this in 3DCoat, I know that you can do it manually but that's not really accurate neither than quick to do. (at least as quick as it is to just place hole). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Jokermax Posted December 18, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 18, 2008 Andrew, here is an idea about layers - it seems to me that sub-objects can be used as layers if we can specify that the sub-objects shares space with other sub-object. You already adding spaces in Copy tool. Does it make sense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member rimasson Posted December 18, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 18, 2008 -some request,Hope this is easy to do. That would be nice to be able to extrude from a spline shape. You draw a shape with the spline tool like you do for creating hole. Than you extrude it with a custom value. Adding a bevel to it would be really nice too. Like that you have your extrude shape with a nice bevel around it. Getting a Stroke from line, like the stroke path in photoshop but with sculpting. You draw a line on your shape, hit Stroke from line, and Tada you got a perfect stroke. The best would be to have a stroke who depend on your alpha, once again like photoshop with brush shape, like that you can do whaetever you want. I suggest this because that can be very handy, I made a test a while before to sculpt totally in Zbrush a futuristic armor. I used mask for the shape on the stomach the ribs and so on and freehand stroke for the hollow that you can see all around. If you add these kind of feature I'm sure I could do this armor totally inside 3DCoat and with less time and a even better Here is the armor I'm talking about: While watching again this picture, I think that a smooth area and a way to make perfect hole is needed too. For the three hole in triangle I used a simple alpha in sub mode, I don't know if there is a way to do this in 3DCoat, I know that you can do it manually but that's not really accurate neither than quick to do. (at least as quick as it is to just place hole). I AGREE !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor tree321 Posted December 25, 2008 Contributor Report Share Posted December 25, 2008 Curves: 1.To circle and to line like as in paint mode. Sphere tool: Conform to surface as an option. Repeat stroke:Draw stroke press-repeat action-draws another stroke along the path of previous stroke. New scene:When creating a new scene camera should be set to default position. From 3DArtist:It would be nice to be able to save a low poly proxy of each object and have a button to switch between low poly proxy and high poly object. The low poly proxy would not be editable but it would free up memory to work on other object(s). Also, being able to set a transparency level for objects would be nice too.End. I agree. Transpose:Soft selection or falloff control on selection,in ZB it is blur mask.Simple slider is all that is needed.Also control over opacity of selected area. Transform: 1.Ability to press left mouse click+shift and drag to clone object. copy tool:When drawing area to be copied it would be nice to see the area you are selecting,like as in a mask selection. With a little fine tuning this would be better than Zbrush extract feature.Good for making clothes,accessories etc. 2.Rectangular,circle,freehand selector. Scene tree:Ability to select multiple objects at once to move to parent,merge,clone,hide etc.Select root object to move all. Curves for manipulation. Surface.pulling, tugging etc.(See attachment below) Edit: Attachment didn't go through.Just see claytools video. Curves for drawing shapes. Ability to combine polygonal objects into scene without converting to voxels. If it requires less system resources. More shaders.Finer tuning of shader tones and color.For instance if you use bronze shader you could vary the color of the shader, redder bronze,greener bronze etc. Slider control over specularity on sub object color and shaders. I know some of these request are simply echoes,but heh. That's it for now.Bye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member 3DArtist Posted December 25, 2008 Advanced Member Report Share Posted December 25, 2008 All those sound really good Tree321. This too is probably already floating around on the forums but I want to add another vote. Voxel Masking (Freezing): Similar to selection in transpose but on the voxels, not the polygon shell. This would allow all the voxel brushes and tools to be used. And an option to extrude the mask selection to a new layer. Anyway, for those that it applies to, Merry Christmas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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