Future development wishlist

[zf3d]

1 hour ago, AbnRanger said:

这些类型的广泛概括无法帮助任何人。它们无法帮助开发人员知道您认为哪里出了问题……具体来说。请给出您认为有问题的具体例子。也许社区中的其他人会确认这一点，然后开发人员就会知道它值得解决。布局设计与 Photoshop 非常相似，因此不会改变。拥有不同的工作空间并没有什么问题，因为 3DCoat 不仅仅专注于一项任务，而是专注于多项任务，因此在一个位置拥有工作室流程一个阶段的所有工具，在另一个位置拥有另一组工具，这在我看来并不不直观。观点。

然而，过去几年我一直要求的一项改进是，重拓扑/建模和绘制网格应该合并/统一，这样它们就不再是单独的对象。这样，UV 工具就全部位于一处。是的，我同意，现在的情况给新用户带来了困惑。

Let me give you my suggestion,
There are a lot of (voxel, clay, surface) brushes now, especially voxel brushes. I have reduced all the brushes to less than 10, which is much simpler. I have given the most important brushes and hidden the others, which is actually a more user-friendly and confident performance. Similar to Blender, which is more concise than Max and Maya, so users have turned to many simple and effective brushes, removing repetitive brushes, which should be one of the ways to improve the interface and be effective.in china  In short,大道至简

 

[rubeos]

6 hours ago, zf3d said:

Let me give you my suggestion,
There are a lot of (voxel, clay, surface) brushes now, especially voxel brushes. I have reduced all the brushes to less than 10, which is much simpler. I have given the most important brushes and hidden the others, which is actually a more user-friendly and confident performance. Similar to Blender, which is more concise than Max and Maya, so users have turned to many simple and effective brushes, removing repetitive brushes, which should be one of the ways to improve the interface and be effective.in china  In short,大道至简

Exactly what I think and what I did.

In my opinion there is still too much redundancy and overlapping of concepts and commands, as well as brushes.
I agree, some rooms are well separated, but others should stick together: sculpt, retopo, modeling (and partly paint).
((I appreciate the effort, but the gesture is faster than the voice. The voice is tiring to pull out every second, I want to be silent when I work.))
To sculpt, the controls must be few and easily accessible.
For 90% of the sculpting work it is enough to have excellent brushes: ''standard'', clay, crease, pinch, grab, flatten, inflate. In addition to masking/hiding/cutting tools based on various shapes: circle, box, line, etc. Other things are rarely needed.
Luckily in 3DCoat already has these excellent brushes and it is not very problematic to customize these things.
Editing, cutting, masking, hiding brushes can all be greatly improved and better integrated with other brushes.

In Sculptris, an old sculpting program, it was possible to globally decrease the number of triangles of a mesh.
The algorithm selected triangles start from the densest parts of the mesh. Often using this command, with awareness, you could have a model with good resolution and detail but with fewer polygons. It’s hard to explain, but it worked.

 

Edited September 22, 2023 by rubeos

[zf3d]

I have received two suggestions from students, which I believe are easier to implement
1
Add a set of shortcut key presets for zbrush to facilitate the transition of zbrush users to 3dcoat, mainly by manipulating viewpoints and switching bump brushes by pressing alt instead of ctrl
2
A tool for adding object boundary measurement boxes is useful for printing, carving, and other work

[Just a user]

only sculpting which is great.

Everything else is too complicated, bad UX, or just too buggy.

Once i have a good sculpt i take it to other software for retopo,uv and paint

the amount of bugs and difficult UX 3d coat introduce outside of sculpting is 4X longer. so in the time ill finish retopo or anything in 3dcoat i can finish all 4 stages on separate apps (blender (retopo), rizom (uv), marmoset (bake), substance(paint). the marketing promise of 3dcoat able to do all of them is not a lie, but the UX and stability and predictability of 3d coat in those areas are so bad that i dont think its doable in a reasonable time frame. 

Modeling is an absolute joke. UX out of the 90s, they think its photoshop, you deselect with ctrl+d. 

This is what happen when developers are hard - headed and refuse to listen. 

Edited June 18 by Just a user

[Sorn]

Like @Just a user, I think instability (bugs, coming and going in quick succession) and how workflows are set-up in 3DCoat make relying on it outside sculpting difficult for me. Also, there are pretty proficient alternatives on many levels of polish and capabilities outside 3DCoat. I rely on them for now.

I'd love to see a flexible UI configurable by the user. To actually be able to drag and drop any UI piece anywhere AND be able to use multi-monitors set-up.

The Linux platform seem to be getting some advancements as of late, but still, until now, it's only a few releases a year with months over months in between. So even if I can understand how this happens and why, it's impractical again to rely too much on this software as a daily driver. We'll see how this goes from now, once some important hurdles get tackled at last.

Documentation is a major lack of this software. And tutorials, even the official ones, are a tad meandering, telling while not showing, very limited in scope and not to the point of the tool and configuration and its effects either. After some time of not using the software, without muscle-memory of what worked, what not, how that combines, and getting up to date of new tools, workflows and new bugs and workarounds gets daunting quickly. It could be better with documentation (what we have now isn't) and YouTube videos showing A)Tools, configurations and usages of said tools B ) Workflows: how to use the tools combined to do some project, tailored to different sectors/industries C) how NEW tools are to be used and which workflows they improve with examples.

I'd like to use it more, and possibly it's getting there, but some considerable work needs to be done to polish what's there: the tool for me needs to be robust, and the UI more flexible if at all possible. I do like 3DCoat, but I need solid tools I can rely for work.
 

Edited June 27 by Sorn

[Sorn]

Having bug fixing and new tools appear in the same builds is a bad decision, to me.

I don't know how feasible it would be, but here's a possible better situation (for the users, developers might hate me for this, but I'm not saying it because I love the Caesar less, but because I love Rome more):

A ) Having a Stable branch: only bug fixes and consolidation of tools and workflows gets here. Builds explain what's fixed, and what major workflows and refined tools are incorporated. Documentation is updated and videos released showing what's new and changed (nothing else than that, to the point, edited, concrete and complete).
B ) Testing branch. A "new tools branch" to test new tools/algorithms and workflows. It's to show and test new tools, or refactoring of older ones. This branch encourages testing, experimentation, discovery of new workflows. Users use it to test bleeding edge tools, and provide feedback on workflows using them to polish functions exposed to the user, how such functions are exposed, and how users combine them to establish new workflows. This feedback is used by developers to fine tune the tools and even interface. Once it all works, feedback can't find bugs, workflows are already in use by some users daily... then they are merged in the "stable" branch. All feedback is taken into account to update documentation and produce new video content to illustrate new tools and workflows intent.

Right now, I need bug fixes, but I get them with new ones (new bugs), along changes in tools and workflows and even UI. It's difficult to work like this. I have to pay attention to too much, and I use other tools as well.
Give us bug fixing, new tools, new workflows and development without slowing down research and testing of tools. Give us: Stable branch of 3DCoat, Testing branch of 3DCoat, and a delicious cake! Well, keep the cake, we'll make our own to celebrate!

 

It's a nice software. We'd really like to use it more. Come on! Go, go, go!!  

 

Edited June 27 by Sorn

[Just a user]

23 hours ago, Sorn said:

Having bug fixing and new tools appear in the same builds is a bad decision, to me.

I don't know how feasible it would be, but here's a possible better situation (for the users, developers might hate me for this, but I'm not saying it because I love the Caesar less, but because I love Rome more):

A ) Having a Stable branch: only bug fixes and consolidation of tools and workflows gets here. Builds explain what's fixed, and what major workflows and refined tools are incorporated. Documentation is updated and videos released showing what's new and changed (nothing else than that, to the point, edited, concrete and complete).
B ) Testing branch. A "new tools branch" to test new tools/algorithms and workflows. It's to show and test new tools, or refactoring of older ones. This branch encourages testing, experimentation, discovery of new workflows. Users use it to test bleeding edge tools, and provide feedback on workflows using them to polish functions exposed to the user, how such functions are exposed, and how users combine them to establish new workflows. This feedback is used by developers to fine tune the tools and even interface. Once it all works, feedback can't find bugs, workflows are already in use by some users daily... then they are merged in the "stable" branch. All feedback is taken into account to update documentation and produce new video content to illustrate new tools and workflows intent.

Right now, I need bug fixes, but I get them with new ones (new bugs), along changes in tools and workflows and even UI. It's difficult to work like this. I have to pay attention to too much, and I use other tools as well.
Give us bug fixing, new tools, new workflows and development without slowing down research and testing of tools. Give us: Stable branch of 3DCoat, Testing branch of 3DCoat, and a delicious cake! Well, keep the cake, we'll make our own to celebrate!

 

It's a nice software. We'd really like to use it more. Come on! Go, go, go!!  

 

https://3dcoat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/30514-3d-coat-bug/#comment-195294
 

I cant even use the software basic functionality 
If this very basic bug will not be fixed in next update ill just ask a refund for my last upgrade 1 month ago, the software is not working and i cant use it 
 

[Sorn]

21 hours ago, Just a user said:

https://3dcoat.com/forum/index.php?/topic/30514-3d-coat-bug/#comment-195294
 

I cant even use the software basic functionality 
If this very basic bug will not be fixed in next update ill just ask a refund for my last upgrade 1 month ago, the software is not working and i cant use it 
 

Although I do agree with you that the software has issues, exposing those and encourage developers to prioritise fixing is the way to go, I'd say.
Publicly sharing our own frustrations is understandable, but of little effect in general if it's left at that. Sharing what's not working and what frustrations it brings, along with expected behaviours of the tools it's ultimately our best chance of getting what we want. Plain expositions of our feelings, even justified feelings, won't get us much.

For what I can use 3DCoat, I do use it and like it. For what I can't, I don't. It could help if more elaborated issues are posted in these forums, with or without frustrations included if they illustrate the issue better. And if those issues seem to not be deemed important enough, dismissed or postponed their tackling at eternum... well, then we better look elsewhere and come back after a while to see if things progressed in a way it benefits us.

That's what I'm trying to do and encouraging you to do as well. Don't take it the wrong way, I fundamentally agree with your points. Just trying to be practical.

 

Edited June 29 by Sorn

[Just a user]

12 hours ago, Sorn said:

Although I do agree with you that the software has issues, exposing those and encourage developers to prioritise fixing is the way to go, I'd say.
Publicly sharing our own frustrations is understandable, but of little effect in general if it's left at that. Sharing what's not working and what frustrations it brings, along with expected behaviours of the tools it's ultimately our best chance of getting what we want. Plain expositions of our feelings, even justified feelings, won't get us much.

For what I can use 3DCoat, I do use it and like it. For what I can't, I don't. It could help if more elaborated issues are posted in these forums, with or without frustrations included if they illustrate the issue better. And if those issues seem to not be deemed important enough, dismissed or postponed their tackling at eternum... well, then we better look elsewhere and come back after a while to see if things progressed in a way it benefits us.

That's what I'm trying to do and encouraging you to do as well. Don't take it the wrong way, I fundamentally agree with your points. Just trying to be practical.

 

1. i wrote 2 detailed posts about how to improve the UX. it has been ignored. 
2. im not a beta tester, im not on a payroll from pilgway. its not my job to QA their tool. the bags im experiencing are pre - alpha level bags. far from the acceptable threshold of bugs expected from every software. im a customer - i pay for the tool to get my creations done. and i chose this tool based on the promised for the features it can provide in a solid state. if the tool can't get BASIC operations done - i did not get what i paid for. its logical not emotional. 

 

[NinjaTaco]

3dcoat needs to overhaul the user experience. Every single time I open 3dcoat I am reminded that older versions of 3dcoat had better functionality in some places.

Retopology room had better hotkeys in old versions. Then the devs started separating the tools to make more buttons.

Combine add/split and split ring functionality using control toggling functionality and ctrl+shift functionality. 

Do not ask us to make these hotkeys we aren't digging into 3dcoat to figure out your hotkey interface tools.
Modo devs told us this and we switched to maya and dumped modo. Maya has marking menus and is designed around heavy production workflows that have come from thousands of hours of user feedback. Modo and lightwave devs ignored user feedback and their user base left.
This is simple user feedback that I know devs probably feel is beneath them when they can just tell their user base to make their own hotkeys by mucking with user interface hotkeys. The 3d graveyard is filled with apps that went this route.
3dcoat needs quality of life improvements that come from well established hotkeys that are context sensitive to the tab that is currently active.
For example... the ` hotkey could be repurposed for each room.
The spacebar hotkey is already repurposed for each room. Take this further. Create regionality for similar functions. (like a color wheel) do not just make another window with boxes inside. Make the boxes smaller and create regional spaces for those boxes to exist in like a marking menu. Either that or create a "find" button for the spacebar menu because it takes too long to read the buttons in the spacebar box. It is slow and cumbersome.

This is your user feedback. Do not ignore your user feedback. Other devs do not have the luxury of getting any user feedback. Once you lose this luxury, you will be flying blind and implementing features that no one will touch.

[NinjaTaco]

Here is a question for the devs. What do you need?

We've been trying to tell you what we need from you in regard to 3dcoat. 

Tell me what you need and I'll see what can be done. Maybe I can't give you everything you need but I might only be able to meet you halfway.

Edited June 30 by NinjaTaco

[Elemeno]

7 hours ago, NinjaTaco said:

3dcoat needs to overhaul the user experience. Every single time I open 3dcoat I am reminded that older versions of 3dcoat had better functionality in some places.

Retopology room had better hotkeys in old versions. Then the devs started separating the tools to make more buttons.

Combine add/split and split ring functionality using control toggling functionality and ctrl+shift functionality. 

Do not ask us to make these hotkeys we aren't digging into 3dcoat to figure out your hotkey interface tools.
Modo devs told us this and we switched to maya and dumped modo. Maya has marking menus and is designed around heavy production workflows that have come from thousands of hours of user feedback. Modo and lightwave devs ignored user feedback and their user base left.
This is simple user feedback that I know devs probably feel is beneath them when they can just tell their user base to make their own hotkeys by mucking with user interface hotkeys. The 3d graveyard is filled with apps that went this route.
3dcoat needs quality of life improvements that come from well established hotkeys that are context sensitive to the tab that is currently active.
For example... the ` hotkey could be repurposed for each room.
The spacebar hotkey is already repurposed for each room. Take this further. Create regionality for similar functions. (like a color wheel) do not just make another window with boxes inside. Make the boxes smaller and create regional spaces for those boxes to exist in like a marking menu. Either that or create a "find" button for the spacebar menu because it takes too long to read the buttons in the spacebar box. It is slow and cumbersome.

This is your user feedback. Do not ignore your user feedback. Other devs do not have the luxury of getting any user feedback. Once you lose this luxury, you will be flying blind and implementing features that no one will touch.

yea you have a VERY fair point , forget adding new features ... ive seen nurbs added , photogrammetry added and none of these are ever used .. as the poll suggested .. your users stick with sculpting primarily , i would love to see the software polished , have a workflow introduced , fix up the ui , make the performance amazing again , and create a stable build that can be used properly ..

i would like to see a zbrush style hotkey for brushes .. (A)djust (T)weak .. etc thats no good for me , just have all the brushes and have the name associate with the hotkey , (CB) for claybuild up (IN) for inflate and so fourth .. 

 

we really need stable , desperately , i want to use 3Dcoat again

[Elemeno]

im curious to know whos used the photogrammetry room?

im sorry to seem like im complaining , but as we say .. sculpt room is unstable , uv room is unstable and paint is missing large features and all this together need a UX rework to help the workflow better .. 

i would honestly prefer a polished sculpting experience , why not make cad separate like textura but cadura... who knows but at least that way a full focus is on cad modelling .. remember ... "10 chefs cooking doesnt make one meal taste better - john" 

 

Edited July 4 by Elemeno

[AbnRanger]

21 hours ago, Elemeno said:

im curious to know whos used the photogrammetry room?

im sorry to seem like im complaining , but as we say .. sculpt room is unstable , uv room is unstable and paint is missing large features and all this together need a UX rework to help the workflow better .. 

i would honestly prefer a polished sculpting experience , why not make cad separate like textura but cadura... who knows but at least that way a full focus is on cad modelling .. remember ... "10 chefs cooking doesnt make one meal taste better - john" 

 

As stated elsewhere, one "Chef" handles certain workspaces and another handles other workspaces. The one who handles the polymodeling and NURBS tools is just doing what he was tasked to do and has nothing to do with the areas you are concerned about. Sending your concerns and requests directly to the developer(s) at Support@pilgway.com is more effective than repeatedly mentioning those, here.

[Elemeno]

1 minute ago, AbnRanger said:

As stated elsewhere, one "Chef" handles certain workspaces and another handles other workspaces. The one who handles the polymodeling and NURBS tools is just doing what he was tasked to do and has nothing to do with the areas you are concerned about. Sending your concerns and requests directly to the developer(s) at Support@pilgway.com is more effective than repeatedly mentioning those, here.

so whats the point of the forum then? can we remove like 90% of the forums then and all bugs features etc sent directly? if people arent happy about me "repeatedly" mentioning things which i havent btw , then you dont need to engage a discussion with me ,
if i do "mention" something about a topic then its main purpose to find other who may have got the same problem , if im constantly emailing them about crashes etc they could be looking for nothing for example 

a few years ago i had a vega 64, 3dcoat constantly crashed .. i was sick of it but it turned out to be a power spike happening on the gpu due to dual rail psu , user error and not software .

[AbnRanger]

9 hours ago, Elemeno said:

so whats the point of the forum then? can we remove like 90% of the forums then and all bugs features etc sent directly? if people arent happy about me "repeatedly" mentioning things which i havent btw , then you dont need to engage a discussion with me ,
if i do "mention" something about a topic then its main purpose to find other who may have got the same problem , if im constantly emailing them about crashes etc they could be looking for nothing for example 

a few years ago i had a vega 64, 3dcoat constantly crashed .. i was sick of it but it turned out to be a power spike happening on the gpu due to dual rail psu , user error and not software .

I am simply saying that it is far more efficient to communicate directly with Andrew. That is what I do when I have a problem with the software. Sometimes I might share the problem on here, to see if others are experiencing the same, but I know the best way to get some action taken on it is to go directly to the man who can fix it.

[Oleg Shapov]

On 7/4/2024 at 9:18 PM, Elemeno said:

sculpt room is unstable , uv room is unstable

If you have specific steps to repeat the instability in your work, please write them.

[Elemeno]

2 hours ago, Oleg Shapov said:

If you have specific steps to repeat the instability in your work, please write them.

nah alot of the time its just general use , sometimes it works sometimes it doesnt , ill make a video soon using 3dcoat and they will show up 

[Elemeno]

its an old bit of software but its free and open source and that is dust3d it has a feature where you dot out an outline and the shape is determined between the size of the cirlces , its hard to explain but its amazing for making organic shapes .. i really feel like 3dcoat would benefit from this 

[L'Ancien Regime]

On 9/22/2023 at 2:03 AM, rubeos said:

Exactly what I think and what I did.

In my opinion there is still too much redundancy and overlapping of concepts and commands, as well as brushes.
I agree, some rooms are well separated, but others should stick together: sculpt, retopo, modeling (and partly paint).
((I appreciate the effort, but the gesture is faster than the voice. The voice is tiring to pull out every second, I want to be silent when I work.))
To sculpt, the controls must be few and easily accessible.
For 90% of the sculpting work it is enough to have excellent brushes: ''standard'', clay, crease, pinch, grab, flatten, inflate. In addition to masking/hiding/cutting tools based on various shapes: circle, box, line, etc. Other things are rarely needed.
Luckily in 3DCoat already has these excellent brushes and it is not very problematic to customize these things.
Editing, cutting, masking, hiding brushes can all be greatly improved and better integrated with other brushes.

In Sculptris, an old sculpting program, it was possible to globally decrease the number of triangles of a mesh.
The algorithm selected triangles start from the densest parts of the mesh. Often using this command, with awareness, you could have a model with good resolution and detail but with fewer polygons. It’s hard to explain, but it worked.

 

If you watch videos of the best portrait digital artists it seems like over 80% of their work is done with the Move tool + Symmetry.