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V4.5 BETA (experimental)


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I'm finding that 4.5.19 and 4.5.20 are completely freezing up my computer so that even CTL ALT DEL doesn't work to clear the problem by shutting down the program. Only pushing the reboot button works.

 

The cause? It seems to have something to do with using the Render room and the casting of shadows calculations.

 

Using Cast Shadows in the Sculpt Room and Real Time Render in the Render Room does it. Perhaps there's a memory leak in there somewhere?

 

Other than that they're pretty stable.

Not saying there isn't a bug/issue, but I just tested it on 4.5.20 GL 64 Windows 10, and no crash. However, the cast shadows option in the sculpt room is pretty graphic card intensive, and is redundant when going into the Render room. It is strictly intended to cast shadows in the Sculpt room, only....because it is already casting shadows in the Render room. It's best to turn it off if you are going to use the Render room.

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So is build 21 going to fix the slow texturing on big uvs and low poly as well?

There is problem with calculation speed. If you have big amount of pixels in pen, Coat needs to handle all of them. The more pixels inside - the slower it works.

Essence of optimisation is that some not necessary calculations removed. But in case when you have high res texture + big pen + many small faces the speed boost will be not noticeable.

If you have smart material + high res texture + big faces the speed boost will be huge.

So making it to work faster under tight conditions where big calculations are inavoidable is really complex task, not just fixing some problem.

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So is build 21 going to fix the slow texturing on big uvs and low poly as well?

Hope so...  :moil:   :paint2:

EDIT:  I just saw Andrew's post so it looks like it require some greater effort at some point in time...

EDIT: Though still painting high resolution textures with smart materials with a brush on big polygon faces still is not really workable till I get to the .250 brush side working on my testbed file of blender scale from my previous post. 

Edited by digman
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Essence of optimisation is that some not necessary calculations removed. But in case when you have high res texture + big pen + many small faces the speed boost will be not noticeable.

 

@ PolyHertz 

From Andrew's post...

Looks like just dividing the mesh would not help much but funny I had thought of the same thing myself without effecting the form of the model so the smoothing routine would work just like if you did not subdivide it.

 

As a side note: in my posting I am not criticizing Andrew but it is an open beta forum thread here and without feedback from us even if it disagrees with the stated improvements in whatever degree must be done... How else is Andrew going to find out if said improvements are really working out on our end. I've been using 3DC from late 2007, so I have been around the block once or twice using the software.

 

At present, no time to be a Mantis bug reporter but will sometimes put stuff here as I see major or long term problems being address...

Edited by digman
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Shift Tool not working on Mac

 

Hello, I have a problem with 3DCoat, think this is a bug..


The Shift (Layer) Tool in Paint Room is not doing anything for me in 3DCoat v.4.5 and above.
Neither the Smudge, Pinch nor Expand Tool Options work, but the smoothing with <Shift> works. 
 
I reproduced like this:
 
- (optionall) delete the ~/3D-CoatV45 folder to have a fresh start
- open 3D-Coat 4.5.19(GL64)
- import Model for PPP, load the sphere or anything else
- paint a stroke with the brush with depth, diffuse and gloss
- switch to Shift tool and draw across that stroke - nothing happens
 
in V3.x and up to 4.1 the Shift tool works for me as expected. If you can not reproduce it, I will be glad to give you any more info you need.
 
Unfortunately V4.1 does not seem to open files that were created with V4.5, is there any way to achieve that?  
 
Specs: iMac (27-inch, Mid 2010) 3.6 GHz / Intel Core i5 12 GB / ATI Radeon HD 5750 1024 MB
OS X 10.10.5 (14F1021)

 

Edited by Metromot
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There is problem with calculation speed. If you have big amount of pixels in pen, Coat needs to handle all of them. The more pixels inside - the slower it works.

Essence of optimisation is that some not necessary calculations removed. But in case when you have high res texture + big pen + many small faces the speed boost will be not noticeable.

If you have smart material + high res texture + big faces the speed boost will be huge.

So making it to work faster under tight conditions where big calculations are inavoidable is really complex task, not just fixing some problem.

 

Thank you very much for explaining this Andrew , this really help us think this over as well.

 

For example , brush size could be broken in parts , brush its always a circle correct?

 

You could "subdivide" / brake  the circle to several parts and have each part scanning a the working pixel area under it  in different priority so unnecessary calculations can really be avoided.

 

Parts that are closer to the cender of the brush can paint with speed and parts that are closer to the perimeter of the brush search to find where each polygon / uv set  ends .

 

I will post an image explaining this in a bit.

 

 

Here is my idea

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/mdfezk2fsrmsnpq/paint_opt.jpg?dl=0

Edited by Michaelgdrs
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The "Low amount of undo steps" problem begins to be really serious. I guess I will stop to work with 4.5.20. Unfortuantely.

 

@Andrew: You should really fix this soon please.

EDIT: Reproduced the problem:::

 

I used a stencil in the voxel sculpt room. 

Next used several smooths to get some of the roughness out.

I did not like the stencil effect

Used undo a few times and then undo stopped working and I could not go back to the original state of the voxel object and was stuck with the stencil effect... I was testing so no major problem but if I was in production.... Ouch big time!

Edited by digman
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4.5.21 [beta]

- Merge/move without boolean combining inserted in VoxTree RMB options.

- Capsule caps parameters are working correctly now.

- Fixed problem of dark spots near seams in per-pixel painting approach if narrow pen used.

- fixed diferent problems related to dropdown menus.

- scripting updated, see Vox object and manual.

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3dc 20beta seems to have more fluid smart material preview, which is great. I laggs way less now while rendering preview. Andrew could you fix importing exteranal AO bug - http://3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=18469? 

Also I miss feature - to right click on paint layer and set it to ao, curvature mask. Right now it is impossible to switch AO/curvature masks 2d layers.

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bocs,

Seems it is different problem. The pixels near seam are semitransparent, all other pixels are just brightly red or exactly red. Because color of pixels behind seam are interpolated between red and grey. I checked and that pixels are not acually darker than linear interpolation between red and grey.

So, this efect appears due to torning off texture filtering. Switch to regular brush and effect will almost disappear.

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It seems painting with stroke type 'single polygon' crashes 3d coat everytime on medium to big polygon size. Try eg, uv paint on demo head, on some larger polygons. 

Works on in 3dc x.19, but x.20 crashes

edit:

actyaly 3dc x.19 has problem too - single polygon, line and posibly other strokes with paintbrush are ignoring smart material condition masks. When I paint with ordinary stroke type, material looks ok, but when using eg. line stroke - material looks nothing like before.

 

Also from time to time earser just stops working on uv model. Restart helps for some time, untill it breaks again.

Edited by JoseConseco
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Yea 3DC halves the brushes paint opacity on any pixels directly touching the UV border.

 

Code wise I'm guessing it is something implemented to help with symmetry, but when not using symmetry is causing issues. 3DC basically needs to determine if there's a massive disparity between what the applied pixels opacity should be and what they actually are after the brush has gone over them. I don't think it's really necessary to do this for large brushes, just small ones or ones affecting a small number of pixels (plus if you did any checks like that on large brushes it'd probably be very slow).

 

The opacity issue aside, there is also the issue of it creating 1-pixel 'streaks' jutting out along the seam away from the rest of the stroke. This may or may not be a separate issue, but needs to be addressed as well.

Edited by PolyHertz
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Is there something wrong with the normal map export presets (Maya/Blender, 3DS Max)? I'm trying to export normal maps from 3DCoat to Substance Painter 1.6, but can't get it to work correctly regardless of which preset I select in the Preferences. I always get seams/ inverted normals in Painter in certain places that are not visible in 3DCoat.

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 Before this update and Andrew working on the seam problem, I would not even have touch painting at 512K texture resolution...  The seams, gave you a big headache...Paint across a seam with even with a larger brush radius with depth and color and there were the seams starting at you...

 

 Now I can work at that resolution if needed. Yes there is some minor clean up but compared to the old way, much much better.    :drinks:

 

There are still some lingering problems for extra small brushes as already stated in earlier postings...

 

Thanks Andrew for working on this long term problem and hopefully you can get the few remaining problems worked out...

 

@Wilson... I just got SP, I will check some exporting from 3DC to SP later today...

Edited by digman
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4.5.21 [beta]

- Merge/move without boolean combining inserted in VoxTree RMB options.

This is a very important and long anticipated feature. Thank you!

 

- scripting updated, see Vox object and manual.

Nice additions. :)

Any chance you could implement methods for dealing with VoxTree and Paint Layers hierarchy in this class?

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I forgot to mention about the feature added a version back...  "Esc in retopo / transform will not clear selection" 

 

Thank you Andrew very much as now I can used the Transform tool with extrude polygons, just setup a hotkey for both and now quickly work down cylinder type of objects when creating the retopo mesh. 

 

This works better than extrude edges tool as they tend to jump all over the place when extruding 

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