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4.5.16

I have a problem with curves with symmetry enabled. When working with them for longer periods of time - doing extrusions, moving their points around, saving curves to .curve files, switching between 3D-Coat and other applications, etc. - I always end up with the following situation:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ro4g632qtj4qzy2/merging_curves.mp4?dl=1

 

The mirrored part of the curve gets connected with the other one every time I attempt to move or extrude a control point.

(Ok, ignore the curves part. Right after posting the video I noticed that it's caused by symmetry snapping. If you're at the wrong camera angle, the point will get snapped to symmetry plane.

Nevertheless, the second part of the problem shown on the video remains):

 

Also, at the end of the video you can witness GUI problems with curve tool's options window. It gets resized whenever I try to move it. It's a common problem of many GUI windows in 3D-Coat. And a very annoying one.

Edited by ajz3d
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Another GUI bug(?). Certain GUI components that allow for zooming, rotation, etc. are acting differently when manipulated with mouse and a tablet.
When I use a mouse, the cursor tries to stick to the GUI component I'm interacting with: https://www.dropbox.com/s/zp6wx5tpqs1vty6/mouse_gui_elements.mp4?dl=1. This feels like the correct behaviour.

But, if I use a pen, then not only the cursor doesn't stick to the component (which makes it difficult to interact with the component if it's located near the edge of the screen/window), but also it makes it go crazy when the cursor leaves 3D-Coat window, or hovers over the title bar while I'm tweaking the value: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ihg1rmoth6r5vib/intuos_gui_elements.mp4?dl=1. For this to happen, the button must be released when the cursor is outside of 3D-Coat's window.

P.S. There's also a problem when tweaking sliders with the mouse if the cursor leaves 3D-Coat window while the LMB is depressed. If I release the mouse button while the cursor is outside of 3D-Coat's window, and hover the cursor back over it, the slider still behaves as if the button was depressed, until I click the LMB again.

 

P.P.S. Has smoothing algorithms been modified in version 4.5.16? Anti-Bump, Powerful Smoothing and Smoothing feel extremely slow.

Edited by ajz3d

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4.5.16

I have a problem with curves with symmetry enabled. When working with them for longer periods of time - doing extrusions, moving their points around, saving curves to .curve files, switching between 3D-Coat and other applications, etc. - I always end up with the following situation:

 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/ro4g632qtj4qzy2/merging_curves.mp4?dl=1

 

The mirrored part of the curve gets connected with the other one every time I attempt to move or extrude a control point.

(Ok, ignore the curves part. Right after posting the video I noticed that it's caused by symmetry snapping. If you're at the wrong camera angle, the point will get snapped to symmetry plane.

Nevertheless, the second part of the problem shown on the video remains):

 

Also, at the end of the video you can witness GUI problems with curve tool's options window. It gets resized whenever I try to move it. It's a common problem of many GUI windows in 3D-Coat. And a very annoying one.

 

I was wondering if anyone else used curves with symmetry...

 

Reported in this thread over a month ago and created a mantis report which still has not been assigned.

http://3d-coat.com/mantis/view.php?id=1992

 

100% reproducible, should be simple to fix.

Definitely a problem with symmetry snap, turning it off fixes the issue.

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I always turn symmetry off when using curves, and then when it comes time to apply them, turn symmetry back on. As a work around of course.

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Is someone observing extreme problems mith curved strokes?

It is hard to reproduce on default objects. Is someone so kind and test curved strokes with the angulator please. I have real problems to mark elements.

 

Regular strokes works great, but the curved ones.

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From time to time, after brushing with various tools (and smoothing), I find myself facing this kind of dirty geometry:

 

post-12523-0-45877200-1441205535_thumb.j

 

Their difficult to dispose of, but usually Powerful SmoothingRemeshing or Reconstruction helps. If it doesn't then the Cut-Off might work (though it sometimes requires multiple usage of this tool to remove this geo).

Sometimes this kind of geometry floats in space, separated from the main surface.

 

Have anyone else noticed similar problems?

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Pose Selection does not ignore geometry hidden with Surface Hide tool. Is it how it is supposed to work?

 

P.P.S. Has smoothing algorithms been modified in version 4.5.16? Anti-Bump, Powerful Smoothing and Smoothing feel extremely slow.

I converted the layer to voxels, filled the voids (Close Invisible Hulls was introducing some artifacts to this mesh, so I decided not to run it) and converted the volume back to surface. I then decimated it back to 400k (the initial polycount from before the conversion) and all smoothing algorithms began working correctly again. So I think the geometry got corrupted somehow. I'll send this VoxTree layer to support later.

Edited by ajz3d

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I'm suffering without drag and drop operations for image files. I want to drag and drop a texture file to Smart Materials window and it would create a default material with this texture, so I can paint on my model with this texture. Manually creating material for any single texture is very annoying task.

Mantis report.

 

In general the 3DC UI is pretty bad about drag/drop functionality. There are a ton of things it doesn't work for at all that you would expect it to (UI groups, materials, brushes, etc.), and where it does work it does so in a less then ideal way.

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Bug: If user closes the left hand tool panel (via the arrow at the top) in the Paint Room all user defined hotkeys for selecting tools stop working.

Looks like this bug has been around for a while but not sure if it ever got a Mantis report.

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When I start 4.5.16 in Cuda mode then voxels are invisible. Starting in surface mode and switch to voxel leads to crash.

 

Solved: updated graphic drivers and now it works

Edited by shape3d

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Pose Selection does not ignore geometry hidden with Surface Hide tool. Is it how it is supposed to work?

 

I converted the layer to voxels, filled the voids (Close Invisible Hulls was introducing some artifacts to this mesh, so I decided not to run it) and converted the volume back to surface. I then decimated it back to 400k (the initial polycount from before the conversion) and all smoothing algorithms began working correctly again. So I think the geometry got corrupted somehow. I'll send this VoxTree layer to support later.

You hit the two bugs I've had for years in 3dc.

Some tools corrupt the geo, it creates the nasty geo you posted, and then since there are holes or non manifold geometry it slows everything down to a point it's unusable.

The only solution is convert back to voxel, lose almost all the work... and the worst part: usually it all comes back...

 

I've had a 3d break for personal work for a while, but the last time I tried to do something nice with it (a few weeks ago), it happened again and went "well so long I'm going to the other one"...

Sad but true. Not hating on anyone here, but those bugs have been around for so long I see no point in trying anymore.

I know it's not easy to pinpoint since I don't even know how to get there myself, but this is so frustrating it makes sculpting in 3dc both the best feeling and the worst experience possible when this happen.

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You hit the two bugs I've had for years in 3dc.

Some tools corrupt the geo, it creates the nasty geo you posted, and then since there are holes or non manifold geometry it slows everything down to a point it's unusable.

The only solution is convert back to voxel, lose almost all the work... and the worst part: usually it all comes back...

 

I've had a 3d break for personal work for a while, but the last time I tried to do something nice with it (a few weeks ago), it happened again and went "well so long I'm going to the other one"...

Sad but true. Not hating on anyone here, but those bugs have been around for so long I see no point in trying anymore.

I know it's not easy to pinpoint since I don't even know how to get there myself, but this is so frustrating it makes sculpting in 3dc both the best feeling and the worst experience possible when this happen.

Yes, it looks like it. Fortunately for me the corruption didn't re-appear yet and I hope it won't.

 

But today I was sculpting some voxel claws and what happened is this:

post-12523-0-42769100-1441545519_thumb.j

It is non-undoable. The surface is treated as if it wasn't there (the brush doesn't react to it) and any attempts to sculpt over it (it's possible only in areas where some other geometry layer is underneath) makes the voxels over the cursor to disappear.

 

If I save and reload the scene, the geometry is back in an intact state. :huh: It is possible that this is a random visual bug. I've seen it happening in the past more than once.

Edited by ajz3d
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I saw this a couple times in the forums , i cant find the posts right now though.

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Yes, it looks like it. Fortunately for me the corruption didn't re-appear yet and I hope it won't.

 

But today I was sculpting some voxel claws and what happened is this:

attachicon.gifcorrupted_voxels.jpg

It is non-undoable. The surface is treated as if it wasn't there (the brush doesn't react to it) and any attempts to sculpt over it (it's possible only in areas where some other geometry layer is underneath) makes the voxels over the cursor to disappear.

 

If I save and reload the scene, the geometry is back in an intact state. :huh: It is possible that this is a random visual bug. I've seen it happening in the past more than once.

Looks like you're hitting on what I've fighted against for years.

You get that, you get the "everything looks fine I'm just gonna brush over this part wow... *boom vertice explosion* wth happened ??!!" one, anyway, it's all fun, once it starts it's a never ending death. 

The only thing I was doing to TRY to avoid that was save incrementaly very often, because you simply trash the scene file when it happens, no point on finding WHEN it happened, you can't know for sure. So you just trash the thing and restart from an earlier segment.

This result in multi Gb projects... and so much lost work you just want to do damage to something.... 

GL.

At this point, I prefer to use the much less practical alternative, it's much less fun, it's heavy on ressources, but at least you can work without expecting everything to fall appart because some bug is in a tool you just used.

I hate to say things like that because obviously A TON of work went into this room, and it shows, but as long as those bugs exist... I prefer to use ZCrappySculpt at least I'm not constantly worried I may have done something that destroyed the entire project without even noticing.

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Looks like you're hitting on what I've fighted against for years.

You get that, you get the "everything looks fine I'm just gonna brush over this part wow... *boom vertice explosion* wth happened ??!!" one, anyway, it's all fun, once it starts it's a never ending death. 

The only thing I was doing to TRY to avoid that was save incrementaly very often, because you simply trash the scene file when it happens, no point on finding WHEN it happened, you can't know for sure. So you just trash the thing and restart from an earlier segment.

This result in multi Gb projects... and so much lost work you just want to do damage to something.... 

GL.

At this point, I prefer to use the much less practical alternative, it's much less fun, it's heavy on ressources, but at least you can work without expecting everything to fall appart because some bug is in a tool you just used.

I hate to say things like that because obviously A TON of work went into this room, and it shows, but as long as those bugs exist... I prefer to use ZCrappySculpt at least I'm not constantly worried I may have done something that destroyed the entire project without even noticing.

I know what you mean. I always end up with hundreds of incremental saves and projects weighting over 100GB too, simply because you never know what might happen... :) I think I learned how to avoid or overcome such accidents (to a certain degree) or which tools or sequences of actions might present a bigger risk of malfunctioning, so it's not that bad. But such problems, whenever they happen, are always frustrating because they break one's creative thinking and force him to interrupt his work and seek solutions to a technical issue. It also eats time.

 

--

Hopefuly after refactoring, it will be easier for Andrew to spot and squash those bugs.

Edited by ajz3d
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Same here , saving and saving and saving , lost a couple project luckily i always keep backup of each running project.

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I know what you mean. I always end up with hundreds of incremental saves and projects weighting over 100GB too, simply because you never know what might happen... :) I think I learned how to avoid or overcome such accidents (to a certain degree) or which tools or sequences of actions might present a bigger risk of malfunctioning, so it's not that bad. But such problems, whenever they happen, are always frustrating because they break one's creative thinking and force him to interrupt his work and seek solutions to a technical issue. It also eats time.

 

--

Hopefuly after refactoring, it will be easier for Andrew to spot and squash those bugs.

 

Yes so true , lets really hope after refactoring, it will be easier for Andrew to spot and TOTAL squash those bugs

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Another corruption, this time after bringing the surface back from proxy mode. The corruption is permanent, meaning that I have lost at least 30 minutes of work and need to revert to a previous incremental save.

I'm using 4.5.16 STABLE build.

post-12523-0-31267200-1441620752_thumb.j

It looks like some parts of the layer managed to return from proxy mode, but the other ones did not (they're still low res).

--

Luckily I remembered to save just before entering proxy mode.

Edited by ajz3d
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Sorry to say that and it is not helpful, but my opinion:

"A stable tool does not mean it is free of bugs. It just mean it does not crash more often than usual."

 

I hope Andrews current work will lead to a more bug free tool. But I am hopeful.

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Yep, I don't even use the proxy /downgrade volume tool as I've had too many times where things have messed up because of it. I'm also with you on the incremental saves which I've taken to doing, - projects rapidly eat up HDD space

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Another corruption, this time after bringing the surface back from proxy mode. The corruption is permanent, meaning that I have lost at least 30 minutes of work and need to revert to a previous incremental save.

I'm using 4.5.16 STABLE build.

attachicon.gifcorrupted_surface.jpg

It looks like some parts of the layer managed to return from proxy mode, but the other ones did not (they're still low res).

--

Luckily I remembered to save just before entering proxy mode.

This is why I have asked Andrew DOZENS of times to PLEASE....Get CUDA or OpenCL involved with the Pose Tool. So, the user doesn't do 30min or more of work in proxy mode, and find out that you've lost not only the work you did in proxy mode, but perhaps everything since your last SAVE.

He's ignored me every time.

....proxy mode can be quite unstable at times

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Haven't been keeping up much, but I guess 3DC is in some sort of code refactoring phase atm? Are we expecting this to result in any performance improvements?

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Haven't been keeping up much, but I guess 3DC is in some sort of code refactoring phase atm? Are we expecting this to result in any performance improvements?

Maybe. The main target of this step is to serve better team development possibilities. This is REALLY much more IMPORTANT than any other wishes. But Andrew told us that there will be some small speed improvements.

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What the heck happened to the stencil navigation?

I am not able to move, scale or rotate stencils anymore by using the shortcuts. Only the buttons in the options window works.

 

Do someone else has this problem?

 

No other update before destroyed my keyset here. Is this because the new smart material navigation?

 

EDIT:
I started the 4.1 Version and there the stencil / masks navigation works perfect.

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