Retopo Room - Next Steps

[Gorbatovsky]

Dear friends!

I am a developer and have been working at 3DCoat for a year now, and have 20 years of experience in developing 3D-CAD.
Andrew told me, that I needed to work on the Retopo room with love.
We need to make excellent tools so that the work gives you only pleasure and satisfaction.
I want to hear your advice.

[haikalle]

This is great news. Welcome Gorbatovsky. Luckily here I can only write your name and not pronounce it  

I think that right now there is just too much tools for small jobs in retopo room. I think that tools like SELECT and BRUSH should be combined and they should be build into that room that there is 
no need to create separate tool for them. I like how Maya is using CTRL + SHIFT + ALT keys to change the different modes. 

Edited March 13, 2019 by haikalle

[Gorbatovsky]

22 minutes ago, haikalle said:

This is great news. Welcome Gorbatovsky. Luckily here I can only write your name and not pronounce it  

I think that right now there is just too much tools for small jobs in retopo room. I think that tools like SELECT and BRUSH should be combined and they should be build into that room that there is 
no need to create separate tool for them. I like how Maya is using CTRL + SHIFT + ALT keys to change the different modes. 

 

Thank you, haikalle

My name is Alex.

I forgot to write that I already made some new tools.
InSet, Bridge, Splite Edge, Improve Bevel.
 

[druh0o]

Hi Alex!

Is it possible to add some tools to mark hard/soft edges (in terms of Maya) in Retopo room?
Or Smoothing Groups:  https://trello.com/c/YldOzYur/95-smoothing-groups-feature-request

 

Edited March 13, 2019 by druh0o

[Gorbatovsky]

Thank, druh0o.

I,m forgot about 3D-COAT Roadmap

I am currently investigating the smoothing task.

[Gary Dave]

Pretty cool!

Retopo is probably my most used room in 3dc. I have no feature requests, but instead would like to see some refinements, like those times that the Points and Faces tool just fails to recognise that a polygon can be created, or symmetry breaking at random, or symmetry really messing with the UV's (not sure if you're working on any of the UV tools in the retopo room?).

Also, and this is more of a wish that probably requires a lot of work. But there is a workflow currently for making some simple retopo mesh, and then bringing it into the sculpt room. (because sometimes it's easier to poly model a shape, than to sculpt it). But the problem is, that all of the tools in the retopo room are really focused around retopology, which of course makes sense, it's the retopo room! But if people are using it to create basic meshes, maybe someone needs to take  a look at much more user friendly way of modelling in this room, without having to constantly switch tools just to create the most basic of meshes.

[MaxC]

Could we have a custom pivot point placement for retopo objects?
(example : I made a crate with a lid that needs a specific pivot point to open correctly. right now I must go to maya to adjust the pivot point)

[Gorbatovsky]

1 hour ago, Max Cederroth said:

Could we have a custom pivot point placement for retopo objects?

Probably I do not understand what you want.
You want rotate object around pivot point without using gizmo?

[Carlosan]

Hi Alex 

Although I do believe that the Retopo room needs to be modernized, both in the performance and in the administration of files; I think it's important to mention that in the long term, retopo room should become a CAD modeler.

As i remember time ago Andrew helps Wings3D development with some lines of code.

Being able to gradually convert the Retopo room on CAD modeling room would greatly help the insertion of 3DC in the market as a total modeling solution.

Thx and best regards

CA

0000616: Possibility to create and manipulate nurbs surfaces and transform them to voxels

[Gorbatovsky]

Hi, Carlosan.

Thank you.

Andrew spoke me about Wings3D.

Today we spoke with Stas that the room Retopo should be divided.

[MaxC]

On 3/13/2019 at 11:39 AM, Gorbatovsky said:

Probably I do not understand what you want.
You want rotate object around pivot point without using gizmo?

I want to export a retopo object with a custom pivot point, so that it is ready to be animated.
(if this is already possible, please let me know!)

[tokikake]

Hi Alex,  to model simple base, I hope to see "Primitive tool" in retopo room .  They are really powerful to make base shape easy. and offer Lattice to modify easy untill generate.

or we can adjust paramaters to change shape.

But I think it is a little pity,  even though they are simple shape, after all, we need to retopo them.  But if 3d coat offer simple primitive tools, and generate  clean mesh (with ratice) in retopo-room (with UV) , it is really useful.  (we can use the mesh in sculpt room too)

 

 

 

[polynut]

Hi Alex and welcome,

So far i didn't have the chance to work with the retopo room but i wonder if we already have something similar to Maya Quad draw if not then this would be a very neat new feature.

 

[L'Ancien Regime]

Any hope for autoretopo?

[tokikake]

If this topic is for retopo process only, forgive me. (make poligon along to volume (sculpt mesh))

What I hope to improve about retopo-room tools, they often work somehow strange when there is no volume. to simple modeling. 

eg when I hope to make faces for  2 edge loop,(outer and inner), there is many tools to make poligons, but actually it is not easy to select point correctly.  

(fill tool, not highlight what I really need to fill, quads tool, or point faces tool,  do not select last point to make quads (point other place, or force to make triangle,,) Though  after all, I can do, but I need to change angle really often, just face(bridge) 2 loops,  and usually make many un-necessary faces. (for worng point )

So if you have time to test of retopo room, check this attached scene , and try to just add poligons (bridge) for this 2 edge loops.  I have never feel difficulity to make faces for this simple loop with other modeling tools.  But only about 3d coat, I still not do these basic job easy.. (it work well, when I make poligons with volume for retopo, but I think there seems some problem to pick point with inner and outer faces (Z-bias?) , (3d coat tend to pick or select wrong place what I intend, or can not select)

 I think, this request seems almost same, what Gary Dave  suggested.   I really think, 3d coat retopo room offer many  powerful tool, but just need some enhancement for steady workflow. 

simple-bridge-edges.3b

Edited March 15, 2019 by tokikake
just to add mention.

[Gorbatovsky]

On 3/13/2019 at 5:40 PM, Gary Dave said:

Pretty cool!

Retopo is probably my most used room in 3dc. I have no feature requests, but instead would like to see some refinements, like those times that the Points and Faces tool just fails to recognise that a polygon can be created, or symmetry breaking at random, or symmetry really messing with the UV's (not sure if you're working on any of the UV tools in the retopo room?).

Also, and this is more of a wish that probably requires a lot of work. But there is a workflow currently for making some simple retopo mesh, and then bringing it into the sculpt room. (because sometimes it's easier to poly model a shape, than to sculpt it). But the problem is, that all of the tools in the retopo room are really focused around retopology, which of course makes sense, it's the retopo room! But if people are using it to create basic meshes, maybe someone needs to take  a look at much more user friendly way of modelling in this room, without having to constantly switch tools just to create the most basic of meshes.

Gary Dave, thank.

I thought for a long time what to answer.

1. As for the mistakes ( Points and Faces tool just fails to), the best practice is to make a small video with the demonstration of the problem.
Programmers will be very grateful to you.

2. Here we would like to discuss new features and maybe what needs to be improved in the interface.
Probably need to divide the room Retopo into two room Retopo and LowPoly->modelling.
 

[Gorbatovsky]

On 3/13/2019 at 2:39 PM, haikalle said:

This is great news. Welcome Gorbatovsky. Luckily here I can only write your name and not pronounce it  

I think that right now there is just too much tools for small jobs in retopo room. I think that tools like SELECT and BRUSH should be combined and they should be build into that room that there is 
no need to create separate tool for them. I like how Maya is using CTRL + SHIFT + ALT keys to change the different modes. 

I would be very grateful to you if you wrote a small list of commands.
I have not used Maya.

[Gorbatovsky]

6 hours ago, tokikake said:

I hope to see "Primitive tool" in retopo room . 

Do you mean Primitive tool from Sculpt Room?

Andrew talked about it.

[Gorbatovsky]

5 hours ago, polynut said:

Maya Quad draw

Hi, Polynut!

I would be very grateful if you add a video with a demonstration.

[Gorbatovsky]

1 hour ago, tokikake said:

So if you have time to test of retopo room, check this attached scene , and try to just add poligons (bridge) for this 2 edge loops. 

Thank, you.

I make litle demo wtih new tool Bridge.

 

[Carlosan]

Hi Alex

As you know Mantis is full of open reports for Retopo Room.

Please tell me (private PM) which is your name profile at mantis, and i can assign all that request to your account.

Thx

 

[tokikake]

1 hour ago, Gorbatovsky said:

Thank, you.

I make litle demo wtih new tool Bridge.

Will it come with new beta?  or if I have alredy the tool ,but just miss it?

 Then I made simple video which use same scene, what cause difficulity when use tools with same scene. 

About quads tool, I think there seems selection order  which seems work better. but usually I hope it work how I start select edge, which I add poligons.

About Point Faces tool, I seems no success about this case. then I stop to use it . 

About RFill tool, as you  can see, I can not find good selection to Fill these 2 edges space.

Then in video, I try to select faces with use rasso brush. It work well when I set selection mode as vertex, but I can not select about edge and faces at all. with these brush,,

coattest_20190315_201507.7z

Then What I requested about retopo room -- primitive tool is same  primitive tool currently offered in sculpt room, in retopo room.  (though some primitive can not offer as retopo object I think,,)  but atleast I hope to see. lattice, and spin tool (I do not know, how I call the primitive,, but easy make shape from spline curve,,)

[druh0o]

3 hours ago, Gorbatovsky said:

Hi, Polynut!

I would be very grateful if you add a video with a demonstration.

I'm not Polynut , but i use Maya too, so here are some videos:

 

 

 

3 hours ago, Gorbatovsky said:

Probably need to divide the room Retopo into two room Retopo and LowPoly->modelling.

 

I understand that adding new modeling tools to the existing Retopo room can make it cumbersome and inconvenient.

But on the other hand,  having retopo and modeling in the same workspace can be useful as you can see in the first video when some modeling and retopo tools compliment each other.

And that's one of the argument for retopo in maya. For example, i can use Quad Draw to build my retopo mesh and immediately can switch to the Multi-Cut or to Extrude, to Bevel or any other common poly-modeling tools.

Another example: to retopo high-poly in maya you need to make it "live" at first, so the points can snap to high-poly. But actually that Make Live functionality is not a retopo thing. That was in Maya for ages. You can use it to place some objects on top of other object,  or to start a new model on top of the existing object.

Edited March 15, 2019 by druh0o

[Gorbatovsky]

35 minutes ago, tokikake said:

Then in video, I try to select faces with use rasso brush. It work well when I set selection mode as vertex, but I can not select about edge and faces at all. with these brush,,

Thank you for video.

But I can't to see it. Also i can't add file on YouTube.

Can you add video on YouTube or make other file? 

[tokikake]

I do not have you tube, then up-load un-zip file in drop box .

https://www.dropbox.com/s/i6pl1y9m0j8nzek/coattest_20190315_201507.wmv?dl=0

you can see it without log in (if you do not have drop box account)

but file is wmv. I do not know you can see it with your PC setting. hope at least you can understand what I request thanks to take your time^^

and I forget to meniton it,, the new bridge tool is really awsom thanks! (hope to use it soon)

 

Edited March 15, 2019 by tokikake

[Gorbatovsky]

43 minutes ago, tokikake said:

up-load un-zip file in drop box .

Thank.

I see bugs.

1. Quads tool ignoring points and vertices of backface.

2. Select by Region not worked in you file.

[MaxC]

On 3/13/2019 at 11:39 AM, Gorbatovsky said:

Probably I do not understand what you want.
You want rotate object around pivot point without using gizmo?

I want to export a retopo object with a custom pivot point, so that it is ready to be animated.
(if this is already possible, please let me know!)

-----

Hi Alex, I am bumping my previous post in case you missed it ^^

[Gorbatovsky]

Max Cederroth

I see you picture, thank.

Which file you using during export?

If using .obj file, than mean, what file not include pivot point.

 

[Dmitry Bedrik]

 

 

And this is not a mockery, this is true. When I saw the room of retopology, the first thing I thought was - did I launch a program from the 90s for Windows 95? The style is exactly that. And usability too. I think it needs to be completely recycled. Of course, this message will soon be deleted, and I will be blocked, as it has already been twice, but I hope sensible people who can somehow influence the situation will see this message.

 

 

What do you need. Just simply.
1) Remove the room retopologii
2) Install Blender
3) Look at his work with polygons (interaction with edges, edges, vertices, convenience of working with hot keys, and, in general, extreme convenience)
4) Find the add-on of Retflu (2.0 will be good)
5) Learn the work of the this addon or Zremesher in zbrush ... source theft would be a good help!
6) Transfer the retopology from Blender (or zbrush) to 3Dcoat. Working with retopology works once a day in 3d coat, I tried it many times, and never got such a result that would have pleased me, even on models that are more complicated than a donut. This is regrettable.
7) in the end, the interface of the retopology room is extremely inconvenient; for the simplest actions, you have to crawl to the left side of the screen each time, with the assignment of hot keys constant problems - they either fly off or reassign.
once again study the work with polygons (the essence is not even in the retopo, at this stage) in Blender and transfer it to 3D. 
9) Listen to the opinion of the person who described a huge number of bugs, recorded them on video, and who have not been corrected a year later, and also made a bunch of suggestions and get ignored by people associated with this program, be it a developer or general director

Edited March 15, 2019 by Dmitry Bedrik

[MaxC]

 

1 hour ago, Gorbatovsky said:

Max Cederroth

I see you picture, thank.

Which file you using during export?

If using .obj file, than mean, what file not include pivot point.

 

I just tried again using fbx. the pivot point for exported objects is always at the origin of the scene.
Should it be possible to export with custom pivot point? or is that not a feature yet?