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3D-Coat: Please, unifies the workflow by fusing the Rooms - Important step for 3D-Coat


Rygaard
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Thanks for sharing these thoughts. Very informative and I agree totally with you.

Having rooms in 3d-coat might actually be a good thing for some users. For example if user wants to do only retopo in 3d-coat. He dosen't need to learn how all rooms work, he can stay in one room and use only specific tools in that to get job done.  But I think that is the only user group that finds rooms to be a good thing. 3d-coat should be supporting those users who is using all rooms and support their workflow.

I think that turning point for need for having "only one room" workflow was when we were able to take mesh from sculpt room into paint room and use paint tools into sculpt mesh. That changed the mindset for artists that object is not anymore linked into room rather is free to be used anywhere artists finds it beneficial.

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7 hours ago, haikalle said:

Thanks for sharing these thoughts. Very informative and I agree totally with you.

Having rooms in 3d-coat might actually be a good thing for some users. For example if user wants to do only retopo in 3d-coat. He dosen't need to learn how all rooms work, he can stay in one room and use only specific tools in that to get job done.  But I think that is the only user group that finds rooms to be a good thing. 3d-coat should be supporting those users who is using all rooms and support their workflow.

I think that turning point for need for having "only one room" workflow was when we were able to take mesh from sculpt room into paint room and use paint tools into sculpt mesh. That changed the mindset for artists that object is not anymore linked into room rather is free to be used anywhere artists finds it beneficial. 

Thank you for enriching the content of this topic with your comments and knowledge!

Exactly what you said about the Rooms being good for some users I had already commented on and I had already noticed.

This separation of Rooms made the 3D-Coat community also separate.
I can tell you the reason later.
The separation of Rooms led people wanting a Room to become more developed than the other Room. And if a particular Room did not develop these people would not mind for the simple reason of not using the Room (tools and features).

I've always seen people on youtube (and elsewhere) saying they prefer to use ZBrush to sculpt and detail their sculptures than to use 3D-Coat. All of these people's work will be done using ZBrush for their personal reasons.
Therefore, 3D-Coat only served only to be used to complete the work of these people using the Retopo Room, and perhaps the Paint Room.

What does that mean?
That means if these people use ZBrush, those same people will not care if the Sculpt Room develops. But of course, the Retopo Room must have priority or another Room that completes that person's workflow.

I know you are free to use any program that you think fits best in your project, but at the same time for the evolution of 3D-Coat as a whole becomes complicated.

We know the power that 3D-Coat has in each room. And when you realize that if a single Mesh could have the benefits of every Room in your favor, you begin to reflect on the numerous opportunities for workflow techniques you could perform within 3D-Coat.
When I talked about Blender and the freedom the user has to use all the tools and features of the program anytime he wanted, this changes the game completely! And honestly I would like the same thing to happen with 3D-Coat.

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Rygaard, where you were as a beginner in 3DC it is a TRUE MIRROR where I am at this moment.

Atm I am unsure if I should quit 3DC or continue invest time to understand 1-2 workflows I barely got an ideeea that might be. I asked people around, I watched almost all the videos (still have few but mostly are on specific tools) and improoved a lot in 4 weeks of working like 6h/day medium every day including weekends. I do not care if other's spent years to achieve skills or did x classes: I am very fast learner and tought myself and others many things.

I made a very decent looking character in vox room and a bit in Surface but I do not need to do a lot though in S for my toon. Still I am very frustrated because I dont find videos DETAILING THE WORKFLOWs for an organic complex character modeled in 3DC. All I have found is in the last minutes of this video which is very brief and fast forward and also this topic.

I am also amazed that I ask questions on this forum with clear points to be answered (and that will help the community as well if answered properly) and all I get are very brief answers. Like I should understand everything from a sentence. I understand people do not have time but if there are so many videos on TOOLS and TIPS and so on, why there are no videos ON WORKFLOWs so novices would know what TO DO. Few words scattered in some videos here and there are FAR FROM ENOUGH.

I am very sure that many new users will not have the patience I did and invest so much time in order TO FIND A WORKFLOW to have 

I am 40y old and I have used many softwares and also some programming but the lack of DETAILED WORKFLOWs in 3DC is just something I cannot comprehend. It is like everybody expects the users to come from zbrush with enough knowhow in order to understand quickly what is what ...

While the video about tools and brushes are good in 3DC Official channels, I got a guidline only from other users --- still those are obsolete and 3DC team should do detailed WORKFLOWs to insert in the beginner's playlists. Maybe some updated techniques on sculpting in 3DC too. 

I get that it was hard for some old users from this forum but do you think in 2019 people should still follow the same roads ? I do not and I can tell form experience that learning is much much faster that it was when I learned X stuff. Everything is faster now and so should be the process of learning 3DC.  

Bottom line: my appologies for any 3DC staff member if they feel bad about my lines but my intention is not to offend anyone but to tell you loud and clear that you have to change the approach to new users and make their life easier. Else your community will not grow but shrink more and more and also who knows how many users did quit in the past and gave 0 feedback. I am sure that you can see some analytics in the forum, on the official website and on facebook that will tell you if the popularity of 3DC grew or shrinked and also details on geographic or returns of visitors. I appreciate 3DC software for what it is offering in terms of tools (at least what I can understand for now) and I do wish it to have more success (though it is very hard without strong marketing and good absorbtion of incoming users).

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On 4/25/2019 at 4:27 PM, v377 said:

Rygaard, where you were as a beginner in 3DC it is a TRUE MIRROR where I am at this moment.

Atm I am unsure if I should quit 3DC or continue invest time to understand 1-2 workflows I barely got an ideeea that might be. I asked people around, I watched almost all the videos (still have few but mostly are on specific tools) and improoved a lot in 4 weeks of working like 6h/day medium every day including weekends. I do not care if other's spent years to achieve skills or did x classes: I am very fast learner and tought myself and others many things.

I made a very decent looking character in vox room and a bit in Surface but I do not need to do a lot though in S for my toon. Still I am very frustrated because I dont find videos DETAILING THE WORKFLOWs for an organic complex character modeled in 3DC. All I have found is in the last minutes of this video which is very brief and fast forward and also this topic.

I am also amazed that I ask questions on this forum with clear points to be answered (and that will help the community as well if answered properly) and all I get are very brief answers. Like I should understand everything from a sentence. I understand people do not have time but if there are so many videos on TOOLS and TIPS and so on, why there are no videos ON WORKFLOWs so novices would know what TO DO. Few words scattered in some videos here and there are FAR FROM ENOUGH.

I am very sure that many new users will not have the patience I did and invest so much time in order TO FIND A WORKFLOW to have 

I am 40y old and I have used many softwares and also some programming but the lack of DETAILED WORKFLOWs in 3DC is just something I cannot comprehend. It is like everybody expects the users to come from zbrush with enough knowhow in order to understand quickly what is what ...

While the video about tools and brushes are good in 3DC Official channels, I got a guidline only from other users --- still those are obsolete and 3DC team should do detailed WORKFLOWs to insert in the beginner's playlists. Maybe some updated techniques on sculpting in 3DC too. 

I get that it was hard for some old users from this forum but do you think in 2019 people should still follow the same roads ? I do not and I can tell form experience that learning is much much faster that it was when I learned X stuff. Everything is faster now and so should be the process of learning 3DC.  

Bottom line: my appologies for any 3DC staff member if they feel bad about my lines but my intention is not to offend anyone but to tell you loud and clear that you have to change the approach to new users and make their life easier. Else your community will not grow but shrink more and more and also who knows how many users did quit in the past and gave 0 feedback. I am sure that you can see some analytics in the forum, on the official website and on facebook that will tell you if the popularity of 3DC grew or shrinked and also details on geographic or returns of visitors. I appreciate 3DC software for what it is offering in terms of tools (at least what I can understand for now) and I do wish it to have more success (though it is very hard without strong marketing and good absorbtion of incoming users).

I just posted a couple of videos that might be helpful.  Not sure if you've seen them before, but I created them a little while back.  I also have a couple of timelapse videos that go through the whole process.

Here is one where I took something all the way to finished.  I didn't do a manual retopology, just an auto topology with some edits.  I'd like to make some more detailed tutorials time permitting.  Manually retopology is generally better.  If you watch these and let me know if you have any questions, I'd be happy to give you some advice.

 

 

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I find the documentation is deplorable in 3D Coat and that's very frustrating because it's my favorite go to tool. The manual is totally superficial to the point of being useless. Videos are scattered and often insufficient (or just completely antiquated) for serious work, leaving vast aspects of a tool's functionality unmentioned. Everything should be thoroughly documented and put up for us the way it is in say, Houdini. 

 

I'm trying to learn the new Polyhedron tool and unless Digman comes back to politely and patiently explain it to me then I'm at a loss. And digman doesn't work for 3d Coat and so it's unfair that he should be the only teacher around here to tell us how to use this program in depth. And man, does digman ever know this program in depth.  Ditto for Vertex Painting. There's one or two very superficial videos on this workflow. When you design these tools why not write down what you're thinking and how they're supposed to be used in a workflow in great detail?  Then just put it up as part of your documentation for us to study.

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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I am also amazed that I ask questions on this forum with clear points to be answered (and that will help the community as well if answered properly) and all I get are very brief answers. Like I should understand everything from a sentence. I understand people do not have time but if there are so many videos on TOOLS and TIPS and so on, why there are no videos ON WORKFLOWs so novices would know what TO DO. Few words scattered in some videos here and there are FAR FROM ENOUGH.

 

I absolutely agree with that. 90% of what I can do in 3D koat now, thanks to just one person. And he is not on this forum.
I see some videos appearing on the program’s YouTube channel, but these videos are kind of boring. Why not ask one of the professionals in this group to make a video of the workflow and upload it to the YouTube channel?

This is a great example. In this video alone, I made the decision to purchase this program. And I was extremely disappointed that, in fact, I learned more from random people about the program than from those who are on the forum.

Please do this. I wrote about this to Andrew, I wrote about it to the sales department, I wrote about it on this forum for six months or so. After all, this is what affects both sales and overall support.

 

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The separation of Rooms led people wanting a Room to become more developed than the other Room. And if a particular Room did not develop these people would not mind for the simple reason of not using the Room (tools and features).

This is partly true. For example, from the whole program I only need a modeling room. Occasionally - retopology. And it really annoyed me that for six months or more, the modeling room remained with all its bugs and errors, while in the drawing room, which I had never used, there were some additions and corrections.
However, in my opinion, this is a matter of psychology of both developers and users. 3D Coat, for some reason, is trying to be both a zbrush and a substence painter, however, in pursuit of both, it lags behind both. I tried to convey this to Andrew, but this was left without any attention whatsoever.

 

However, how do you propose to realize this, ultimately, this "union" of rooms? In a Blender, these are the same rooms, only called tabs. In Zbrush, the same thing, only called modes or tools.

The rooms are a cool and original thing, as if some aspects of the program would not annoy me. With the current speed of development and the fact that Andrew adds new cool things, only for a fee to him personally, this association will take an excessively long time.

 

 

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9 hours ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

I find the documentation is deplorable in 3D Coat and that's very frustrating because it's my favorite go to tool. The manual is totally superficial to the point of being useless. Videos are scattered and often insufficient (or just completely antiquated) for serious work, leaving vast aspects of a tool's functionality unmentioned. Everything should be thoroughly documented and put up for us the way it is in say, Houdini. 

 

I'm trying to learn the new Polyhedron tool and unless Digman comes back to politely and patiently explain it to me then I'm at a loss. And digman doesn't work for 3d Coat and so it's unfair that he should be the only teacher around here to tell us how to use this program in depth. And man, does digman ever know this program in depth.  Ditto for Vertex Painting. There's one or two very superficial videos on this workflow. When you design these tools why not write down what you're thinking and how they're supposed to be used in a workflow in great detail?  Then just put it up as part of your documentation for us to study.

There are hundreds of tools/features to cover, so Pilgway is not going to create all new videos for them every few years. What you think is antiquated doesn't mean it no longer works. The Paint tools/brushes still work the same today as when the videos for them were made. The videos covering vertex paint are more than sufficient to explain how it works...which is to say, the same as with Paint Meshes that have UV's. Instead of color/gloss/metalness information being stored on a UV map, they are stored on the vertices of a Sculpt Mesh. The videos mention that and that's about all there is to it. No need for a bunch of videos covering it.

The videos are stored on Youtube in playlists.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCz7E0meXd2yMj4TKY2h0Rbg/playlists

It's where most software companies keep their training content, and it's the most high traffic location to store them, so they are easy to find the appropriate video.  All you have to do is type the feature in the search field of the channel, and it will usually bring it up. As for the Manual, it is still very adequate for getting around in 3DCoat, although they do need to update it. Artman did a really good job on the LiveClay section.

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10 hours ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

I find the documentation is deplorable in 3D Coat and that's very frustrating because it's my favorite go to tool. The manual is totally superficial to the point of being useless. Videos are scattered and often insufficient (or just completely antiquated) for serious work, leaving vast aspects of a tool's functionality unmentioned. Everything should be thoroughly documented and put up for us the way it is in say, Houdini. 

 

I'm trying to learn the new Polyhedron tool and unless Digman comes back to politely and patiently explain it to me then I'm at a loss. And digman doesn't work for 3d Coat and so it's unfair that he should be the only teacher around here to tell us how to use this program in depth. And man, does digman ever know this program in depth.  Ditto for Vertex Painting. There's one or two very superficial videos on this workflow. When you design these tools why not write down what you're thinking and how they're supposed to be used in a workflow in great detail?  Then just put it up as part of your documentation for us to study.

....Also, regarding the BETA curves tools, which the Polyhedron tool is a part of, they are still under BETA development. When Andrew says they are done and no longer Beta, then official feature videos will be made. There are too many changes being made and still to be made, to create them prematurely. For one thing, I asked Andrew, as others have, if he could have the new curves toolbar section tear off and able to pin in the viewport for easier/quicker access. He agreed it should be done, but we will have to see if he does. I would not really want to show the curves without this core functionality.

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....Also, regarding the BETA curves tools, which the Polyhedron tool is a part of, they are still under BETA development. When Andrew says they are done and no longer Beta, then official feature videos will be made. There are too many changes being made and still to be made, to create them prematurely. For one thing, I asked Andrew, as others have, if he could have the new curves toolbar section tear off and able to pin in the viewport for easier/quicker access. He agreed it should be done, but we will have to see if he does. I would not really want to show the curves without this core functionality.

However, when it became possible to create objects through curve profiles, the video came out without problems.

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2 hours ago, Dmitry Bedrik said:

However, when it became possible to create objects through curve profiles, the video came out without problems.

The developer working on them made those. When the toolset is complete, there will be more complete videos covering them.

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13 hours ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

... Everything should be thoroughly documented and put up for us the way it is in say, Houdini. 

Houdini's online Learn is divided into several parts:

1. Getting Started

2. Learning Paths 

3. Tutorials /  Experts 

4. Talks & Webminars

5. Schools & Training 

6. Education Programs

----------------------------------------

It is interesting that the tutorials are subdivided by 

- Categories

- Levels 

- Industries 

- Versions

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3 hours ago, AbnRanger said:

....Also, regarding the BETA curves tools, which the Polyhedron tool is a part of, they are still under BETA development. When Andrew says they are done and no longer Beta, then official feature videos will be made. There are too many changes being made and still to be made, to create them prematurely. For one thing, I asked Andrew, as others have, if he could have the new curves toolbar section tear off and able to pin in the viewport for easier/quicker access. He agreed it should be done, but we will have to see if he does. I would not really want to show the curves without this core functionality.

Thanks for explaining this. 

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I think that for the most part, people really want a normal tutorial. Like Eric Keller wrote in his book Introduction to Zbrush, where everything is chewed from the very beginning, to some relatively complex (for beginners) things.

1041346.jpg?t=20160708184857

(450+ pages)

In fairness, blender, zbrush, that a number of other programs, manuals from developers do not differ in detail and details. In fact, the instructions “how to make a dragon out of a default ball” are written by professionals or those who have recently learned to sculpt these dragons themselves. That is, those who use the program as a hobby and / or for work.

You didn’t often see that game developers, for example, starcraft, were tournament champions, or that Gabe Newell was the record holder for speedy passage through half-life? 

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You know what would make the best basis for a meticulous manual, in the manner of Houdini? 

 

The programmer's notes buried right in the code.

 

// We need to multiply quantity by 2 here because they are bought in pairs
cost = quantity * 2 * storePrice;

 

All the  code  is annotated to avoid confusion as it's passed up and down the pipeline of labor . It should be a commentary that goes into the greatest detail not only what each tool is doing but what each parameter inserted is for and how it's linked to other operations and  dynamic databases within the program. That's the kind of molecular level of information that the  manual we need should be drawn from. It's not 3D Coat v2 anymore. It's a serious vital tool now, not a casual toy.

 

That's probably an insane thing to propose but it felt good to say it.

 

 

 

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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I mean, just look at this; this is just one little detail from an immense section on rendering in Houdini with Mantra and how it's connected with lights, and cameras and materials, ROPS (Render Operators) and SOPS (surface operators) and on and on.  (The Diffuse Limit is just one obscure parameter among dozens perhaps a hundred, maybe thousands of parametric adjustments

dl.thumb.PNG.a0ffb14a909510b166569c70477890c6.PNG

 

In this example, increasing the Diffuse Limit has a dramatic effect on the appearance of the final image. To replicate realistic lighting conditions, it is often necessary to increase the Diffuse Limit. However, since the amount of light contribution usually decreases with each diffuse bounce, increasing the Diffuse Limit beyond 4 does little to improve the visual fidelity of a scene. Additionally, increasing the Diffuse Limit can dramatically increase noise levels and render times.

 

1397210589_diffuselimit.thumb.PNG.e0ce60a3a98be143bb49168ecf641caf.PNG

https://www.sidefx.com/docs/houdini/render/limits_tab.html

 

It's beautiful. That's a beautiful little render.  And it edifies you. It's almost like it's the Holy Bible of VFX and CGI.  This is how I'd like to see the manual for 3D Coat. 

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19 minutes ago, Carlosan said:

I may be an idiot but that leaves me utterly mystified. He's in Clay, he's putting down some kind of curve then suddenly there's a central green line from which the profile will be rotated, there's some drop down menu and we're in Surface mode.  There's no explanatory voice over...

 

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The ideal workflow would be if 3d Coat emulated GeoMagic, with polygonal/ subD/ NURBS/ BREP/ and then OpenVDB tools all in one modeling package so you could just seamlessly go back and forth between modeling modes at need. No need for amateur hour hard surface modeling tools. The real deal for machine design with BREP and NURBS. If nothing else your bevels and chamfers would be perfect regardless of the underlying shape of the surface. Then voxelize it for sculpting like Geomagic's free form sculpting.

 

 

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why people here very often looking on CAD tools in 3d coat? Do you understand what it's sculpt software and this is have nothing with CAD. Do you think engineers will use sculpt tools? CAD have own formats and eco system for production, calculating weight, and you can change every step without undo
Though i want to have tools for making perfect hard surface to make product render for concepting, right now you cannot make perfect shapes to have perfect edges on renders in big resolution like in zbrush 

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With all due respect to your opinion, I will always have my head open for any type of tools and implementations for 3D-Coat so that, precisely, we artists have at our disposal anything that makes a difference in our work.
But at this point of turning 3D-Coat into a program like GeoMagic, Rhino or other programs that have a more focused on Nurbs and other things, I try to understand, but seriously, I really don't understand.
As I said, if there are tools or features that help in the workflow, that's fine with me, I will always wishes that to happen, but the program turns into something for CAD, Nurbs and etc, I'm sorry, but it would be easier to buy GeoMagic itself or Rhino or Autodesk Fusion 360 or any other program that already has this type of work direction or workflow.

The developers of 3D-Coat have already included in the program and if I am not mistaken, they are improving more and more tools and features aimed at Curves type Nurbs (non-destructive).
I like that, but when it comes to sculpting, Nurbs doesn't make any sense.

What is really making 3D-Coat 4.9 start to shine is in the organic sculpting part. Speaking of the organic part, now, with the implementation of Base Brushes, the program has, in my opinion, the best and most robust brush system on the market.
Any artist who enjoys sculpting will have great moments of pleasure sculpting with this new and robust brush system.
Now, we all have an "anabolic" brush factory (literally), in which you can refine the brush with different types and combinations of effects (different types of brushes) to get exactly what you want, the possibilities are huge and the sky is the limit!

Imagine what will or may come in 3D-Coat 2021...

The most important thing, in my opinion, is that 3D-Coat can further unify Rooms, as this is essential if we wanted to use any tool and functionality that exists inside the program in the same Room or space.
Instead of jumping out of rooms and using a specific tool or feature and then going back to the Room you were working on previously.
The current process completely breaks the creative part and the efficiency at work.
Of course, the user can use shortcut keys to go to a specific room, but even so, unfortunately it is not the same as using tools and features in the same area you are working on and most importantly, in the same mesh structure (geometry).

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On 1/1/2021 at 5:44 AM, sprayer said:

why people here very often looking on CAD tools in 3d coat? Do you understand what it's sculpt software and this is have nothing with CAD. Do you think engineers will use sculpt tools? CAD have own formats and eco system for production, calculating weight, and you can change every step without undo
Though i want to have tools for making perfect hard surface to make product render for concepting, right now you cannot make perfect shapes to have perfect edges on renders in big resolution like in zbrush 

Actually a lot of CAD tools have added SubD toolsets, even Alias, and with Grasshopper and Dynamo there's a lot of momentum towards procedural tools in there too. Rhino has some sculpt capability now.

The point is that when you want to model the world there's all sorts of things that have to be modelled and no one toolset can comprise all the necessary workflows to attain them. Model an engine block without proper bevels and chamfers like Siemens NX or Creo or Catia is an impossibility.  Both Modo and Houdini with the Modeler plug in have a workaround with Mesh Fusion, derived from Groboto's initial work. 

3D Coat is my favorite program because Andrew is what I call an advanced thinker. He can take a white paper proposal and implement it as a vital toolset that nobody ever thought was necessary or possible, as he showed by being the first person to implement automated retopology, or the first person to implement sculpting with voxels. He beat Houdini to the punch with voxel implementation. I think that he could blow everybody away, MOI3D, even Rhino, Modo, even Maya  if he just focused on making 3D Coat the ultimate artist's modeling toolset.  Obviously he's not going to be able to take on Catia ICEM Surf or Autodesk Alias but Maya has a NURBs toolset (not a very good one either it's basically Alias 1999 or something like that).

NURBS does make sense but more importantly BREP makes sense. Look at the incredible variety of work now being produced by 3D Coat users. It's not just organic modeling anymore. You're missing the point if you think Geomagic is just NURBS. They bought Freeform which was the first computer sculpting program, preceding Zbrush by several years. It was a project by a team at MIT using an expensive haptic device so it never caught on.  Thus in Geomagic you can create seamlessly in NURBS, BREP, SubD, polygons, or if you choose, a kind of dynamesh that allows you to sculpt and then go back and forth at need or at a whim. This is the ideal for creative people. You shouldn't have to be limited by a specific app to where your creative desires lead you.

 

I mean look at this; is this organic sculpting? This is the work of one of the foremost users of 3d Coat.

 

 

r2SWtdq.jpg

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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Yes this sound good, but you forgetting many things all those programs have multi views what 3ds coat lack because it focused on sculpting like zbrush. It need to change whole program.

I think it is useless, just read all around what people thing about 3d coat, what it's good program but have many bugs what cannot be fixed many years. It have glitch with meshing in surface mode, black artifacts, producing holes. 3dcoat cannot make perfect hard surface. This video what you are showing to me is useless, it is good for showing small preview but you cannot make product renders from this models in big resolution because you always have jagged edges with triangles. Try to render this mask in 4k resolution you will see artifacts and you cannot show this images to client just like concept sketch.
I prefer to focus developing on fixing bugs and making good UX\UI, sorting tools, adding search etc.
Many peoples dreaming about fixing bugs many years. I am watching tutorials and all of them talking about bugs, strange behavior etc. Curves very not user-friendly comparing to corel draw or moi3d and you want NURBS and BREP with them? Maybe you did't know what CAD is not about NURBS but it also have opportunity to change every step what you did before without undo like i said before, though moi3d don't have this feature

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CAD is about BREP. I said that already. Not NURBS. NURBS is more for elegant surface designs like car bodies and expensive yachts.

And your argument merely serves to reinforce my idea; all these people trying to do hard surface modeling with voxels, or polygonal ngon mesh or dynamesh or even SubD's are making peepee in the wind (yes, Blender 2.90+ too). BREP is the ultimate in hard surface modeling, especially when it comes to  splitting or shatter booleans or any other kind of boolean workflow not to mention elaborate chamfers and bevels.  A solid BREP modeling system in 3D Coat would solve your problems and I bet Andrew could implement it quickly if he wanted to. If he did it all with a non destructive node workflow like Houdini  that gave you a bulletproof dependency graph/history then so much the better.  And as a by product that would also open the door eventually to parametric modeling like Autodesk Dynamo or Rhino Grasshopper down the road.

This is a model using NURBS tools, polygonal tools, subD and voxels with Houdini's OpenVDB tools, translating back and forth effortlessly between modes, entirely within Houdini, no plug ins, no  Vanzhula Modeller.  I often wish that SideFX would just purchase 3D Coat and bring in Andrew as a senior developer at Houdini.

Rather than seeing a move like this as ignoring old glitches and bugs, I see it as leapfrogging those problems in an audacious manoeuvre  that simply makes your vexatious old bugs disappear into irrelevancy with an entirely new innovative approach. This is what Andrew excels at; rapid innovative development that no one else has done.

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Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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I am talking about not feature but how comfortable you should use 3dcoat. how BREP will work without views, now you can't work in several view and will need extra clicks to change view. I am doubt what Andrew can make more better workflow than moi3d. If it will be worse then why you should use one program if you can make it in another like all user useing 3d coat. Sculpting in zbrush, paint and unwraping in 3dcoat. Even retopo can be made in other program more comfortable. Polygons modelling in 3d coat not good because of UI\UX. Even text looks bad to me compare to other software.
You have Blender all-in-one then why you do not sculpt and paint there? Why you want another all-in-one program if only few old people will using it. Andrew made new material node system for rendering but i am very doubt what it will be useful if you can render in other great render engines like blender, or corona, vray, etc. If you know what is it corona render when you should know it's so popular because of simple settings what take less time to setups scene than vray, it have user-friendly UI. In now day you need not only many features but also good UI for comfortable work and fast setup. That's why we see moi3d, marvelous designer, affinity photo, marmoset toolbag, quixel mixer, world creator 3 and other great standalone tools.
I hope 3dcoat team will start to work with community more closer, making poll with features for example and hear people about bugs and UI. By the way another useless feature imho in 2021 grouping tools without logic and still have scroll, i have no idea what reason to make this...
 

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I agree with you about the render engine development. Instead of developing their own they should have simply created a deeper link embedding Renderman and Radeon Pro Render with full functionality rather than making their own. 

But then perhaps Andrew just fancies exploring render engine development for his own satisfaction.

I don't care for Blender as admirable as it may be.  Perhaps I just don't want to have to develop the muscle memory to run a workflow that demands elaborate hotkey combinations that change their sequence with every plug in you load into it.  Personally I like the different work rooms in 3D Coat.  The layers bar is annoying though with accidental shifts from Voxel to Surface mode always a hazard.

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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