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Interface discussion


polyxo
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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 2 weeks later...
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I haven't,

My life is quite difficult at the moment, and our studio was handling some movies VFX that where quite heavy. I've been working on it, but haven't got the time to give news here or to Andrew. That's the reason why I haven't been very present on the forums or with Andrew.

Sorry to make you all whait, things are settling down, but I will post what I've been working on this week so you people get something fresh.

A.

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Just a quick comment. I think the "Vox Follow" tool could be renamed to "Vox Smudge", as that's what it basically does. People who have used Photoshop, ZBrush, et al are probably quite familiar with what "smudge" does.

I'll agree with that. When I first saw it I thought "Follow? What the heck does that do?".

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  • 3 weeks later...
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I have to second the Silo followers here. The out of box experience is great, so I dont have to think about modifiying the design because the workflow is very ninja. All the tools have a purpose and I dont see any redundancies. I would agree that you should take out any buttons that are repeated. Really think about how the tools are used and combine functions logically.

It seems to me that voxel and poly sculpting need the same tool-set. Maybe its not so much a voxel interface that pops up, but that you have voxel and poly primitives, both can occupy the same space, with the same sculpt tools but voxels just behave differently. Layer management could control visibility.

It is great that 3D Coat is so easy to configure, but that is more work. If you get the basic workflow smooth then 80-90% of your customers will have a great experience.

Something that I liked about Zbrush was the ability to browse through some different interface configurations. I could see a sculpt, paint, pose and render interface.

Color Choice: Personally I would like all the colors to be muted. Greys work as they would allow me to concentrate on the work at hand.

Also since so much of the layer types are like PS, it would be cool to have very similar icons and placement. I think that many people understand Photoshop and that would make the transition to 3dcoat much easier, especially since I consider voxels to be 3D photoshop. So for instance instead of freezing geometry, I would use the lasso paradigm and use that to make selections or invert selections.

Also a true fullscreen mode would be awesome. If the right click menu could be customized so that I could drag and drop commands into the right click box, that would really be like a blank canvas and the right click was a pallete. That way I can load up the right click with all my commands, and get rid of many toolbars.

is a tut I did in Rhino At 2:04 you can see the customized toolbar. Heck if you could load in the color palletes and brush editors in there that would truly increase speed.

The Less distance that my mouse has to travel from my model to the interface the better.

First impressions when opening up 3D coat- too much text. Unrefined interface. Font choice could be better.

Second impression- Dang Andrew is really a hard worker, and this is a supportive user-base.

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Sorry to make you all whait, things are settling down, but I will post what I've been working on this week so you people get something fresh.

A month has passed :P

Sorry to tell this, you are a great designer, but maybe you are not paid properly to follow this project full time, and this is not your fault.

Andrew I am not the right person to tell you what to do with your software, but the impression I feel reading this thread, is that you are building up the interface in a non professional way.

I apologize to sound harsh, it's only my point of view

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A month has passed :P

Sorry to tell this, you are a great designer, but maybe you are not paid properly to follow this project full time, and this is not your fault.

Andrew I am not the right person to tell you what to do with your software, but the impression I feel reading this thread, is that you are building up the interface in a non professional way.

I apologize to sound harsh, it's only my point of view

Yes, really, there was no money paid for this. Only enthusiasm.

But main problem is that I have several core features for V3 that must be made in fist order before essential interface tweaking.

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  • 3 weeks later...
  • Contributor

Andrew, is there anything that us users can do to help you with the interface such as icon designs and things like that.I think we all have modelers and/or a paint program and I will do whatever I can to further this development phase.

I guess we need to come up with a general color scheme and basic icon look so we can all help in the design while staying consistent with the look.I think more icons is important for some of the main tools used.Too much text=too much reading to make a decision.Bad icons=What in the world does this do? :huh:

Hope some of us can pitch in to help.

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Matt Gorner is apparently working on a LightWave Core interface at the moment, but I still think he'd be awesome for this.

His older LightWave VX interface project:

http://www.creactive-design.co.uk/lightwav...ject/after.html

And a sneak Peek at his new Core VX2 interface. (Click the Core logo)

http://www.creactive-design.co.uk/lightwave_vx/

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I think the best solution for interface improvement is complete customization.

This way you reduce the whining factor to a very minimum.

That would be great.

If there are functions they don't use the users should be able to remove them.

Also it would be great if the hotkey assignation was updated to allow setting

hotkeys to a lot more functions...like the voxtree rmb button(like delete),shaders ect...

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I think the best solution for interface improvement is complete customization.

This way you reduce the whining factor to a very minimum.

That would be great.

If there are functions they don't use the users should be able to remove them.

Also it would be great if the hotkey assignation was updated to allow setting

hotkeys to a lot more functions...like the voxtree rmb button(like delete),shaders ect...

What I liked most about Silo was the customizable interface.I spent quite a bit of time making icons for it,it was fun and personal.

This interface discussion will probably get fairly heated considering all the different opinions out there so full customization is probably the key.Andrew just needs to figure out a basic layout I guess.

I've used all the 3d software packages out there, so I'll know if I like it when I use it.I've gotten so used to 3D-Coats present interface that I could even live with it.(Not that I want to).

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What about possible help - I need mockups of

1) Ideas how to place tools. For example VS has many buttons and options of current tool are placed below and are not visible well. How to place all this stuff? How to place pens options? ...

2) General requests about what is missing in interface.

2) Maybe modern and cool theme. You can play with buttons and intrface pics using files Textures\stdbutton.tga (button), Textures\stdbutton2.tga (hole), Textures\vista.dds (gradient over buttons), Textures\icons\baseicons.dds (icons)

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It seems to me that the sculpting section of 3D coat should be used with a Wacom tablet, a tablet pc or penable screen.. That said, I have always found Sketchbook's menu's to be the most fluid pen style interface.. I believe that 3DC has the most inovative aproach to 3D sculpting. Why not have an innovative pen style interface that enables gesturing?

I love the hotbox in Maya.. If 3DC had a hotbox system that allowed people to organize tools in any way they want, 3DC would be set..

At first I thought of the hotbox as a way to access menus with minimal mouse movement.. It was when I saw a Gnomon video tutorial with Alex Alverez that I realized that the hotbox is more than that.. The hotbox is more like a little map that teaches you how to make rapid gestures on the screen.. You start in the center and more N, Ne, E, Se, S, Sw, W and Nw to get to the next option which may present you with another set of N S E W options.. Alex was working so fast that I couldn't even see how he was accessing features.. All I saw was a jagged lightening strike crossing the screen.. After a while using the hot box, the actual graphic menu barely appears.. Now your gesturing..

A video showing off the Hotbox..

Here is another more simple example of Alias wavefront's innovation with penable menus.. Ooops.. Autodesk..

http://area.autodesk.com/sketchbook_preview..

Take a look at this vid..

http://area.autodesk.com/themes/site_theme...king_menus.html

Thanks,

IC

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I quickly came up with a basic UI draft but who knows if it is of any use for future UI ideas. Anyways here it is.

Also take a look at this UI/functionality for the upcoming Sketchbook. Looks interesting at least.

Sketchbook UI

That's 2 for Sketchbook.. I must have been writing my post at the same time..

IC

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What about possible help - I need mockups of

1) Ideas how to place tools. For example VS has many buttons and options of current tool are placed below and are not visible well. How to place all this stuff? How to place pens options? ...

2) General requests about what is missing in interface.

2) Maybe modern and cool theme. You can play with buttons and intrface pics using files Texture\stdbutton.dds (button), Textures\stdbutton2.dds (hole), Textures\vista.dds (gradient over buttons), Textures\icons\baseicons.dds (icons)

Hi !

I make a button, but on 3Dcoat i dont have my button...

dds

stdbutton2.jpg

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Dont forget this, when you develop a new GUI:

"A user will never need a complex description, if he can read."

What I mean is: Everyone have to invest more time to memorize new symbols, then icons. If you search something, you will find it much faster, if it is written. And if you have someone to teach or explain something and you are not at the same place, f.e. you are phoning or typing(chat). Then it is much easyer to tell your partner the name of the menu or the word, than to explain the symbol: "It looks like a moon, but not really, it could be a sun too. No, maybe more like a ape from mars?" ...

Of course there are some disadvantages if you are using words, too.

1. Icons don't need to be translated, maybe their tooltips... ;)

2. Icons don't need as much room in your GUI as words.

Another point:

I know, a lot of people like adjustable GUIs. The advantage is, that you can create your own individual workbench. That is cool.

But: If you visit your friend and wanna show him a really cool approach, believe me: You will find nothing. That makes you frustrated. So, don't forget to build a "set to default"-button into the prefs, please! :)

I am teaching sometimes and it is really important to have a similar gui for the understanding. I am never changing my own preferences, because of the arguments I told before.

I just wanted to mention this.

Be creative

Chris

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personally I would like to see peoples designs of the first thing they would like to see when a new user enters 3D coat rather than showing customisable ideas.

Yeah, we now again run into the danger of just piling up what single users consider the most practical UI features of other programs.

Certainly one has to look at good solutions found in other programs - but a hundred single peas still don't make a soup.

And imo too many cooks will spoil the soup even with the most delicious ingredients.

There will always be someone who wants more salt or some leaves of salvia... and others who protest.

A single person could probably come up with something far more convincing by sitting down a couple of weeks.

Ideally this would be a seasoned graphic designer with strong analytic skills and at least a basic understanding

of programing.

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