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If I upgrade to 2022, will V4 be unusable ?


Yousung
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If I upgrade to 2021, will V4 be unusable?
I haven't officially upgraded yet, but I've seen the explanation that upgrading the license will make the V4 license deactive


182365656_bandicam2021-07-1309-31-58-029copy.thumb.jpg.7cd59becee3b3829039366b47363d596.jpg

 

 

884731092_bandicam2021-07-1309-35-45-605copy.thumb.jpg.809cb1ad8adc26648e9140e43ee49a73.jpg

After that, will the V4 of this image become unusable?

 

 

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On 7/19/2021 at 5:03 PM, 3DC Support said:

The 2021 license is platform-independent, so you can essentially upgrade one license key to the 2021 version and use it at alternative times on two machines. However, if you need a simultaneous use on two machines, then both keys need to get upgraded to 2021 so you have two independent serials. 

 

Just to be clear, there's no obligatory yearly maintenance fee imposed: once you get the 2021 license you receive 12 months of free program updates. With that you can continue using your latest upgraded version then for as long as you wish without paying for another 12 months of updates. If you want to keep your 3DCoat more or less constantly up-to-date, your upgrade window would work as follows: 

  1. Initial date of purchase + 12 months = free program updates;
  2. buying 12 months of program updates at any time from 13th month until 24th month since the initial date of purchase = 40 eur;  the date of this purchase now becomes your 'new initial date of purchase' and the rule of cl. 1 above applies again;
  3. buying 12 months of program updates at any time after 24 months since the initial date of purchase = 90 eur; the date of this purchase now becomes your 'new initial date of purchase' and the rule of cl. 1 above applies again; 
  4. therefore, you don't have any strict maintenance window to miss. Secondly, even if you upgrade a few years after, you will not be forced to pay higher price for all future updates: whenever you decide to get upgraded, we treat it as your 'new initial date of purchase' and the rules described in cl.1-2-3 apply gradually, depending on the date you purchase the 12 months of program updates next time.

So, we tried to develop a policy of upgrades that would be non-intrusive and flexible enough. It would be interesting to hear your feedback on that approach.

Please, let us know if you have any further questions or concerns. 

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Oh no! This is not good. I'm using a stable(for me) V4 and can't change 3dcoat versions for work. Glad I found this little info.
Why is it like that? It's very Autodesk, Adobe....
Let us be able to use V4 while allowing upgrades.

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Thanks for clarifying! That's good enough for me.
Although the situation that someone would upgrade to 2021 and then have the ability to sell their older V4 license seems illegal and should not be allowed at all. Pilgway should be able to easily monitor any license transfer of that and stop it.   If they want to sell their license then it should be the current license plus all their previous license.  

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It gives a new license every time I press the confirm button.
There seems to be a big problem.
Shouldn't there be only 1 license? Currently,
5 different license numbers have been added.

The v4 license still appears in my profile.
Anybody else having the same problem?

When I pressed the first confirm button, the window did not close and there was no notification.
So I pressed the button a few times and nothing happened.
When I refreshed the page, I saw that there were many licenses.

Or do pilgway give you buy 1, get 4 free :)

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  • Carlosan changed the title to [Solved] If I upgrade to 2021, will V4 be unusable ?
  • Carlosan pinned this topic
  • 2 months later...
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On 7/13/2021 at 2:32 AM, Carlosan said:
On 7/19/2021 at 9:03 PM, 3DC Support said:

The 2021 license is platform-independent, so you can essentially upgrade one license key to the 2021 version and use it at alternative times on two machines. However, if you need a simultaneous use on two machines, then both keys need to get upgraded to 2021 so you have two independent serials. 

 

Just to be clear, there's no obligatory yearly maintenance fee imposed: once you get the 2021 license you receive 12 months of free program updates. With that you can continue using your latest upgraded version then for as long as you wish without paying for another 12 months of updates. If you want to keep your 3DCoat more or less constantly up-to-date, your upgrade window would work as follows: 

  1. Initial date of purchase + 12 months = free program updates;
  2. buying 12 months of program updates at any time from 13th month until 24th month since the initial date of purchase = 40 eur;  the date of this purchase now becomes your 'new initial date of purchase' and the rule of cl. 1 above applies again;
  3. buying 12 months of program updates at any time after 24 months since the initial date of purchase = 90 eur; the date of this purchase now becomes your 'new initial date of purchase' and the rule of cl. 1 above applies again; 
  4. therefore, you don't have any strict maintenance window to miss. Secondly, even if you upgrade a few years after, you will not be forced to pay higher price for all future updates: whenever you decide to get upgraded, we treat it as your 'new initial date of purchase' and the rules described in cl.1-2-3 apply gradually, depending on the date you purchase the 12 months of program updates next time.

So, we tried to develop a policy of upgrades that would be non-intrusive and flexible enough. It would be interesting to hear your feedback on that approach.

Please, let us know if you have any further questions or concerns. 

Expand  

Wish I had seen this post before I asked my question on release cycles. Sigh. :)

How do beta features apply to this 12 months updates cycle? 

If I was to purchase today would I lose features intended for the 2023 version that were currently stable in the 2022 cycle when it is released in 6 months or so? 

I guess what Im trying to ask in a very botched up way is, are all features that are classed as stable and no longer beta included in that 12 month cycle?

I know beta features were removed in full releases in the past. Or that's how I remember it.

If you can decipher what Im asking your a better person than me. lol

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

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On 1/21/2022 at 10:09 PM, Mykyl said:

Wish I had seen this post before I asked my question on release cycles. Sigh. :)

How do beta features apply to this 12 months updates cycle? 

If I was to purchase today would I lose features intended for the 2023 version that were currently stable in the 2022 cycle when it is released in 6 months or so? 

I guess what Im trying to ask in a very botched up way is, are all features that are classed as stable and no longer beta included in that 12 month cycle?

I know beta features were removed in full releases in the past. Or that's how I remember it.

If you can decipher what Im asking your a better person than me. lol

 

Cheers

 

Mike

 

Thanks for the question, Mike. Think I understand what you're trying to ask, correct me if I'm wrong:)

The 12-month time period for free updates is the main factor here - whatever comes out within that time you get at no extra charge. So, if a 'beta' feature turns into release within this period, you get it for free. If a feature is in beta and turns into release only after your 12-month period expires though, you can get it as part of a new 12-month package at the cost of 45 euros. Essentially, after your 12-month update period expires you have another 12 months to opt to buy a new update package at that same price, so you can choose the best moment to do that (based on your preferred feature set, the program's performance, releases etc.)

Hope that makes sense.

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The ability to use older versions needs to be available.  I've already encountered several bugs in 2021 that aren't there in Version 4.  For instance, I was doing a retopo of one part of a sculpture.  I found that after I finished and unhid the rest of my model so I could see the retopo while seeing the rest as a sculpture revealed that my entire sculpture was all screwed up.  That was using Version 2021.70

I tried this 3 different times, thinking that maybe it was something I did differently each time, but it kept happening.  I loaded up a trial version of 4.8.25 and was able to do what I needed to without issue.  Another thing that worked better in version 4 was that I could delete a point I placed using Points & Faces Tool without delay, but in 2021, it would take forever just to delete a point every single time I had to do it.  Simply put, retopology works better in version 4 than it does in 2021, despite 2021 having some really nice new features.  It's faster and less buggy even when using features that were already in both versions.

I'm not sure about the older versions, but 2021 doesn't appear to retain my desire to use CUDA when sculpting, so I have to select that option whenever I load even the same file.

Those of us with licenses really need to be able to move back and forth between versions as bugs get identified and as the program develops new features.  Things break, but we should be able to continue working.

Edited by alvordr
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Hey, Carlosan.  I may, but it's not always efficient or appropriate to test new versions while you're actually working on something.  I did try 92 recently and found it also somewhat buggy.  That's why I was using the "stable" release of 70.  My point before was that having access to an older version fixed my issue, but I had to use it as a Trial version, which is limiting for licensed users.  If nothing else, perhaps the answer is for us to be able to license different versions, not just upgrade our license to the point that it no longer works with the older ones.

I'm not trying to sound or be insulting, as we really appreciate all the hard work on this wonderful program, but 2021's retopo and paint room seem to be a little bit of a step backwards.  I say paint room, because I'm also noticing that seeing the colors of what I'm painting on a dark model (dark shades of various colors) are also more easily seen on Version 4.  I don't know if it's the lighting or what.  Room independent lighting would be useful.  Lighting needs to be separate for separate rooms, so if you get it just right for the render room, it may not be quite right for the paint room, etc.  Also, I noticed that getting between rooms went from 1 click to two. 

Version 4 example of how it treats split rings on a mesh (conforming correctly):

image.png.b21e5907da5f7e69f76127a083d6670a.png

Version 2021 example of the same thing where adding a split ring doesn't conform correctly:

image.png.bc17767af6d1c6226868a4cd86a5e57f.png

Version 4 example of paint room to see what you're painting more easily:

image.thumb.png.939c776a074bde1bd83051d4bfc8501e.png

Version 2021 doesn't appear to be as useful for seeing what you're painting:

image.thumb.png.343f1859499759879f1c59056ae21ed0.png

 

Back on licensing, I may be misunderstanding how the licensing works.

EDIT:  Wait.  I just tried my Version 4 license I bought some time ago on Version 4 and that worked, while my Version 2021 license works for the new one, so maybe that's already allowed? If not, I'll uninstall one of them.  If it's only for a year or some time limit, that's not the solution I'm after.

 

 

Edited by alvordr
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Great, now my whole model has lost all the paint work I did.  2021 is just not ready for stable work at all, even when using the "stable release."  I guess I'm back to either going to an older save, foregoing hours worth of work doing retopo and sculpting, or foregoing hours worth of work on repainting this thing, unless there is a way to copy paint layers from one file to another.  Considering I hadn't retopo'd everything yet, I doubt it.

You can imagine how time consuming it can be to sculpt, retopo and paint this as a low-poly, realistic model.  I still have work to do on the claws, legs, and then repaint it.  That's before I can even consider rigging and animating this thing.

Before the loss:

image.thumb.png.a0937d9d4af41a4370d793253226a4ad.png

image.thumb.png.d62923d705124c10606c6ee32ba2dc14.png

 

After:

image.thumb.png.c0802beb2cf29642dc656370689122cf.png

Edited by alvordr
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Do you know how sculpt layers work in 3D Coat?
If you made Surface (vertex) paint and delete the layer all the color information was deleted.

In the Paint Room, Layers are used much like you would in Photoshop or other painting applications, where aspects of each Layer can be controlled independently, such as blending modes and opacity but with additional control over how Depth painting affects the Layer in question.
On Sculpt room, instead of colour information it has deformation information per layer. So for example one layer could be for large sculpting deformations and then another could be for fine details, etc.

----

Sidenote: I don't understand why you work on the original version and instead of overwriting it, make first backup copies to continue testing from there.

It is not a good practice to work without backups in this or any software.

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Hey, Carlosan.  All I was doing at the time was working on one small portion of my retopo and saved the file.  I wasn't sculpting or painting.  When I opened it up, all the paint information was suddenly gone.

In fact, after yesterday, when I was also working on retopo, the whole model ended up doing this, so I had to quit using 2021 and ended up using Version 4 to finish what I was doing:

image.thumb.png.8122bcd28c491f0dce0041ac731004f1.png

Luckily, it occurred to me to use an autosave just now and that worked to get me most of the way back to where I was.

image.thumb.png.8335c8222d5167101f771b52f645625f.png

Edited by alvordr
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I ended up giving up on 2021 and just using Version 4.  Version 4 was just much faster, less bug-prone for retopo, copying symmetry, painting and sculpting and a better all-around experience.  The project isn't done, but I've been able to take it much further because of this.  This is why I was saying we need access to the older versions.  

Even the render looks better in Version 4 (notice the reddish tinge on the underbelly):

image.thumb.png.c66caaa2e987ef7840ddae43717e542c.png

Version 2021 below:

image.thumb.png.fe031de1373f3c56dd129ae1825a2e77.png

Edited by alvordr
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  • Carlosan changed the title to If I upgrade to 2021, will V4 be unusable ?

If possible, please send me the scene where the info is lost.

In all known cases losing the info happens because of incomplete saving due to reboot or crash.

Generally, very soon I plan to make the system that reports if there is risk of loosing the information.

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  • Carlosan changed the title to If I upgrade to 2022, will V4 be unusable ?
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On 7/27/2022 at 5:26 PM, Carlosan said:

Subsequent update at 45 Euros (from month 13+ following the purchase) or 90 Euros (from month 25+ following the purchase) with another 12 months of free updates.

My free updates was 13.07.2021 up to 13.07.2022.  So I have till 13.08.2023 to avail of the 45 euro upgrade?  +13 means what?

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