Member Stanley Posted May 30, 2009 Member Report Share Posted May 30, 2009 Macintosh systems have a comparable location for storing application data and user settings. A storage location like the one below would be more consistent with Apple's Human Interface guidelines: ~/Library/Application Support/3D-Coat/UserData/ More design reference material that may be of interest: http://developer.apple.com/documentation/M...ToPutFiles.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted May 31, 2009 Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 I cant paint specular in per pixel painting, anyone else having this? No but I can't undo any painting. Funny thing about the UAC warning is that I don't get it if I click the actual program icon in the Program Files folder, I only get it if I click it in the Start menu. Edit: I didn't notice there was an update, so I have no more Undo issues. Only issues I really see now are the residue left after erasing. And I've found an update to the Paint > freeze > Ctrl-Freeze > Erase bug. If you hit Unfreeze All, now you can correctly erase the spots you couldn't before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member 3DArtist Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Andrew, I've noticed that the soft stroke in voxel sculpt does not seem to work like it does in paint mode. In the paint mode, the stroke follows the tail. But in voxel sculpt it does not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted May 31, 2009 Contributor Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Am I the only one for which quadrangulation has no effect at all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applink Developer haikalle Posted May 31, 2009 Applink Developer Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 you are not alone Artman with this one. I'm using v.87 because it suit perfectly with my workflow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted May 31, 2009 Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 I sent in a report, but will post here too. 3DC crashes when importing UVs. (moved from Bugzzz thread) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member David Walters Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Funny thing about the UAC warning is that I don't get it if I click the actual program icon in the Program Files folder, I only get it if I click it in the Start menu. Looks like there are still files in the 'Program Files' folder being written to, so it's probably best to fix these first before switching off 'Run as Administrator'. Otherwise the files just get lost in the virtual store and cause a world of pain. FWIW, these files were newer than my installation time: Log.txt; UnknownShaders.txt; window.txt; text.xml; License.dat; materials/default/Paper_bump_prv.tga; materials/default/VoxelToolSets.xml textures/patterns/*.xml Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted May 31, 2009 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Thank you for comments! Really, 3DC is still too raw to be released. I postponed release on one week. But anyone who wants to buy it right now will be able to do that even during the week before release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member ghib Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Just thought I'd mention that the size difference between the Sample Objects 'TiledSubdividedPlane' & the other example models are very large. It might be worth unifying them by scaling the TiledSubdividedPlane down to 0.03 of it's current size. I can't see any reason that I'd merge sample files together but other people might. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Maximus3D Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Perhaps we should try to organise bughunting/squashing a bit more to both make the job easier for Andrew and also to get the job done faster, to help him get the final out the door faster. If we set out to hardcore test one specific feature at a time, say we spend a day or two focusing on the brushtools and the next we focus on texturing or whatever. Or we could team up into smaller teams of 4 users who hardtest certain things, file bugreports of everything they find and we could have Andrew release new builds 2-3 times a day which we then repeat the same job until feature X and Y works perfectly. Otherwise with a little bit of touching one tool or feature at a time here and there we instead end up with something that's never really gonna work or be full of bugs causing crashes and other nasty issues. This type of cooperation ofcourse requires that everyone takes responsibility and actually do test what they're supposed to and test it in every possible way they can think of to track down any possible bug in the tool. The endresult would benefit us all with a better functioning, more stable and solid release of 3DC. / Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Nester Posted May 31, 2009 Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Hi,Andrew: a small suggestion There are three coordinate values(X,Y,Z) at the right Bottom corner.They show the location of digital pen.When painting or Sculpting,they jitte very much.I think it impacts eyes.Is anyone else has this situation? I think you can make them a button to hide them at the right Bottom corner."When necessary, click the button to show they.When not necessary,hide them." This is only my suggestion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member mocaw Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Perhaps we should try to organise bughunting/squashing a bit more to both make the job easier for Andrew and also to get the job done faster, to help him get the final out the door faster. If we set out to hardcore test one specific feature at a time, say we spend a day or two focusing on the brushtools and the next we focus on texturing or whatever. Or we could team up into smaller teams of 4 users who hardtest certain things, file bugreports of everything they find and we could have Andrew release new builds 2-3 times a day which we then repeat the same job until feature X and Y works perfectly. Otherwise with a little bit of touching one tool or feature at a time here and there we instead end up with something that's never really gonna work or be full of bugs causing crashes and other nasty issues.This type of cooperation ofcourse requires that everyone takes responsibility and actually do test what they're supposed to and test it in every possible way they can think of to track down any possible bug in the tool. The endresult would benefit us all with a better functioning, more stable and solid release of 3DC. / Magnus Good idea- and maybe there could be a thread dedicated JUST to those topics of testing? I think having one separate group test the whole program all as much as they can at the same time is a good idea since a lot is interconnected. Then again if you have four groups hard testing the four major sections of the program all the time it might be just as if not more effective! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member ghib Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Good idea- and maybe there could be a thread dedicated JUST to those topics of testing? I think having one separate group test the whole program all as much as they can at the same time is a good idea since a lot is interconnected. Then again if you have four groups hard testing the four major sections of the program all the time it might be just as if not more effective! Ok, this does sound like a great idea. I would like to test the Per Pixel painting side of things as I actually hardly ever even look in the Voxel window these days (I feel others are more competent in this area so I leave it) Next for me would be the Retopology tools. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Maximus3D Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 mocaw: Yes a separate thread, or threads would be good for this to keep things easy to overlook and to see the progress of each team testing each separate part of the application. And i agree, some tools are related to eachother and ofcourse those have to be tested so you see how well they work together. We should have had this from the beginning instead of now at the end of the developement cycle. ghib: If you consider yourself skilled enough at testing the per pixelpainting tools then you're welcome to do so. But you should focus all your energy on those tools and the workflow now and when the testing of them is finished then you can move on to different things like retopology. Just so things don't get messed up and you end up jumping between different types of testing, this only confuses things more. / Magnus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member ghib Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 But you should focus all your energy on those tools and the workflow now and when the testing of them is finished then you can move on to different things like retopology. Just so things don't get messed up and you end up jumping between different types of testing, this only confuses things more./ Magnus Sure, I can understand this I originally bought 3DC as a replacement for Bodypaint so I'd be happy if this side of things were sorted for the release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Amber Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 3.0 RC ------ Not really bugs ... rather some most obvious usability issues. pick color palette should be resizeable and dockable when pick color pallete is open undo doesn't work color picker should be existing also as a tool in a pick color palette (in Photoshop when you mouse over from pick color pallete to image cursor changes into pick tool) Layers > Opacity when very slow when trying to drag Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted May 31, 2009 Contributor Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 I also recommend a week long halt on posting feature requests....there will always be this and that that we would like to be more like this and that. And "cool ideas" we might have to make 3DC better... Let's just focus on what we have right now and make it the most bugfree possible. As far as team goes I think it is already afoot because everyone here use 3DC with focus on different things which is perfect for bug testing. As a future buyer , artifact free merging for microvertx and lookinggood normalmap from merging for Dp are what i expect most. Other users who are already deep in per pixel painting will notice bugs in the painting actions that I would't even notice because I didn't started already. As far as voxel sculpting goes I don't agree with peoples who says the brush feeling isnt there. The feeling is just awesome,you just need to really sculpt and not really look for a specific clone of a mb/zb brush . This way ,you can understand more behavior behind 3DC brushes and achieve desired effects. I'm pretty sure someone like Alex Oliver would get a touch of voxel and would be hooked in an hour. Look at Tree321 sculpts...I don't hear him complain much about the sculpting "feeling" Yes the brush speed with large brushes is awful ect...but what have we ; perfect even topology all the time,booleans,never the feeling to be hurting some polygons underneat even if we've been pinching the model to death...I mean,this is a "feeling".This will all improve anyway,it is such a young app. Feeling is one thing...artifacts is another. Those should be the focus of voxel improvement before release. Andrew fixed artifacts with flatten brush, scrape work very cool...things can only get better. (But I still think fill brush should detect much more cavity and the filling should work with large brushes). I think main focus should be: -Clear Dp of any dangerous bugs because it is a very awaited feature -Good normalmap in Dp merging(not everyone will want to use external package like xnormal) -Artifact free merging for microverts -Artifact free voxel brushes behaviour -Pose(seem already fixed...but not shader issue when scaling...it's very important thing to fix,because users won't notice and they will keep on sculpting but with shader so messed up that they won't see cavities as they really are(same thing happen with transform).) -Dangerous Ui bugs if any left. -Uv tool should be most bugfree possible... -fix any retopo tools quirks -and dangerous general bugs fixing evrything that it's sole purpose is to just to improve user experience or be a timesaver for this or that actions should be left on the ice for a week I think so Andrew can have clear interference free bug squashing macho action. anyway all thing revolutionary are experimental at first and we are pretty lucky to be part of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted May 31, 2009 Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 pick color palette should be resizeable and dockable I keep mine docked. Load it from Windows > Popups or just hit B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member kay_Eva Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 I nominate amber, philnolan3d, and 3didiot to be the master coodinators of our bug squashing/testing campeign ^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted May 31, 2009 Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Aww shucks... Anyway, artman mentioned fixing retopo quirks. I just checked to see that I can still move the vertices away from the model. This makes retopo very difficult to use, because say I'm using the Quads tool. After I lay down some quads, I then have to go in with the Move Verts tool and make sure each vert is actually snapped to the surface, then some more quads, the check verts, etc. it makes retopo very slow and tedious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Amber Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Adjust subpatching Vetex lighting should be Vertex I suppose philnolan3d @you are right I didn't notice it, I've still a lot of to discover in 3DC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Paint Guy Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 How many people here are testing 3DCoat on the mac? I just wonder because their will probably be bugs specific to both the Mac and PC operating sysyems. Also I agree on the focused approach to squashing bugs and I look forward to helping out where I can! It would be good if someone could post an "agenda" so we could all see who is doing what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member erklaerbar Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 I would think it would make sense to concentrate on the most annoying bugs. This is personal, it depends on how specific users work with 3Dcoat. So IMHO it would make sense if everyone names the 2 issues/bugs he hates most. This would ensure that Andrews energy goes into fixing the right stuff. Obviously a web board is not exactly the right tool to collect that documentation. But we could agree on some terms. I would propose the following: 1) Set up an own thread, 2) everyone has exactly 1 reply/subthread 3) Everyone names in this subthread the 2 bugs he hates most, 4) and documents the bugs with short and precise info on replication. What do you think about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Amber Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 I would think it would make sense to concentrate on the most annoying bugs. This is personal, it depends on how specific users work with 3Dcoat. So IMHO it would make sense if everyone names the 2 issues/bugs he hates most. This would ensure that Andrews energy goes into fixing the right stuff. Obviously a web board is not exactly the right tool to collect that documentation. But we could agree on some terms. I would propose the following:1) Set up an own thread, 2) everyone has exactly 1 reply/subthread 3) Everyone names in this subthread the 2 bugs he hates most, 4) and documents the bugs with short and precise info on replication. What do you think about this? Well,that's a very good idea but I won't make any threads/subthreads ... My most hated bugs(or rather most critical to fix are) : [*]params tool and pen tool needs improvement in rotation - now in 3DC there is no easy or good way to make patterns with satisfactory effects, -params tools doesn't like curved areas - equalize/subdivide doesn't help, pattern is sinked into mesh or is disorted -pen rotation angle isn't perfect I'm not sure if it will be possible to fix till release but anyway should be on top priority - it's one of the core feature,which is used very,very often so soon I won't be the only one complaining about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Oliver Thornton Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 The thread has been created: http://www.3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=2690 I posted some guidelines based on the suggestions posted here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted May 31, 2009 Contributor Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 Well,that's a very good idea but I won't make any threads/subthreads ...My most hated bugs(or rather most critical to fix are) : [*]params tool and pen tool needs improvement in rotation - now in 3DC there is no easy or good way to make patterns with satisfactory effects, -params tools doesn't like curved areas - equalize/subdivide doesn't help, pattern is sinked into mesh or is disorted -pen rotation angle isn't perfect I'm not sure if it will be possible to fix till release but anyway should be on top priority - it's one of the core feature,which is used very,very often so soon I won't be the only one complaining about it. Yes, I had to pass on the Curve tool, as I couldn't get it to behave. It was the same surface dive. And a brush rotation that followed the stroke would be very welcome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member kay_Eva Posted May 31, 2009 Advanced Member Report Share Posted May 31, 2009 how about an official listing and poll on the most important bugs maybezzzz i'm too lazy to do it though hehehehehehe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member soulvector Posted June 1, 2009 Member Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 Oh, I didn't know it was planned to be released so soon. Ive been cramped with stuff so there has been no time for writing down feedback yet. No shame in releasing it with a couple of bugs since everyone else does it and Im sure that for those who haven't heard of it yet it will be a much welcome surprise. Most of my thoughts are about how to make current tools more suitable for specific situation such as having surface based falloff as an option to volume based. So my ideas can definitely wait anyway. Q. Are there or will there be any raw voxel export formats? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 No shame in releasing it with a couple of bugs since everyone else does it and Im sure that for those who haven't heard of it yet it will be a much welcome surprise. Yes, honestly all software is released with bugs. It's just up to the programmers to decide which bugs to leave in and which to fix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member MattVG Posted June 1, 2009 Member Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 Regarding the submitting of bugs: it might be good to have four(?) different threads for bug submitting; one for each section of 3D-Coat rather than one huge one. It'd be a bit more orderly that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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