Member Beeavision Posted February 23, 2011 Member Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Hello again, I'm relearning 3D Coat all over again since its been a while since the last time I used it. Anyhow the problem I'm running into now is with some text I modeled out in Lightwave that seems to either crash 3DC or simply merges into a black irregular shape in the background. I take it that 3DC doesn't respond well to objects containing polys with greater then four vertices. I did however try to triple the object's mesh prior to importing it into 3DC but the same thing continues to happen. See screen shots below for details.... The first image was taken in Lightwave. The second in 3DC followed by the third after merging. The black mesh which appears as a line across the screen is what I get for a voxel model. Not sure why this is happening or if I'm missing a step somewhere that's causing this. Thanks, Erik Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 23, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Also the text objects above are completely closed from front to back. And all vertices are merged together as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor AbnRanger Posted February 23, 2011 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Thanks for bringing this to everyone's attention. I wasn't aware that there was an issue with N-Gons, but apparently there is. The thing is, they give Max problems too, even though it's supposed to be able to handle it. I've imported some text from LW into Max, and had a similar kind of mess. What I did is used the trusty old cut tool to divide the front faces up quite a bit. Even though there was still a number of n-gons left, Max handled it much better. As quick and dirty options,you could use 3DC's Text tool or try to use the Sketch tool with renders of the text from a front orthographic view and top orthographic view in LW. I would use a self illuminating (white) material, and just render a simple black and white image of the text. Bring those images into the sketch tool and you should have the same result. I would increase the resolution on the layer once before you hit APPLY or the ENTER key. If you need to smooth the edges some, you could hit "Smooth All" a few times until you get what you want. Still, I'm surprised that it didn't merge better. Nevertheless, there's more than one way to skin a cat with this object. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 23, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 That's what I thought. Thanks for the help. I couldn't for the life of me remember what they were called (N-gons). As for the text I plan on sculpting battle damage along the surface with rebar sticking outward from inside the text itself. The text will kind of resemble a building with bullet holes and such scattered throughout. I plan on bringing it back into Lightwave after exporting it out as a high poly mesh and then render it in LW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 23, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Well apparently 3D Coat is having trouble with the text objects I bring in from Lightwave no matter what I do. Even if the object has no N-gons. I'm guessing there must be unseen data saved to the vertices when using the text tool in Lightwave that is causing havoc in 3DC. So anyhow I went ahead and used the text tool in 3DC. It works but seems to disappear when I try to use brushes on it. I'm also having issues trying to straighten it out so that it sits flat on the grid standing up. Also what does it mean if the the object turns to a black 3D silhouette and lighting has no effect on it in the voxel room? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor AbnRanger Posted February 23, 2011 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Well apparently 3D Coat is having trouble with the text objects I bring in from Lightwave no matter what I do. Even if the object has no N-gons. I'm guessing there must be unseen data saved to the vertices when using the text tool in Lightwave that is causing havoc in 3DC. So anyhow I went ahead and used the text tool in 3DC. It works but seems to disappear when I try to use brushes on it. I'm also having issues trying to straighten it out so that it sits flat on the grid standing up. Also what does it mean if the the object turns to a black 3D silhouette and lighting has no effect on it in the voxel room? With the Text Tool active, you have to click 2 points (I use an orthographic view) to set the initial scale and location, in the tool options, you would want to check "Apply to whole curve." You can rotate the object in the Tool Options as well. When you are relatively happy with it, click ENTER or the APPLY button. Remember, anytime you use these construction tools, they act as molds for 3DC to fill with voxels. When you hit ENTER, you're telling 3DC you're ready to do so. The tool will keep the mold in place, so you can continue to use it, until you click another tool.Autopo works fairly well in this situation, so you may give that a try to get your text back into LW. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OnCyegCaBw8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 I have had no problems with n-gons merging to voxels, I've actually been doing a lot of that on my current project. In Modeler try hitting M to merge any doubled up points, Shift+I to merge any doubled up (co-planar) polys. Also while in Poly selection mode hit W for the poly statistics to see if there are any 2-point polys, they might cause problems. If so just hit the + to select them and delete. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 23, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Thanks for taking the time to show me. I'm going to give it another shot tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 23, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 I have had no problems with n-gons merging to voxels, I've actually been doing a lot of that on my current project. In Modeler try hitting M to merge any doubled up points, Shift+I to merge any doubled up (co-planar) polys. Also while in Poly selection mode hit W for the poly statistics to see if there are any 2-point polys, they might cause problems. If so just hit the + to select them and delete. Yeah I did all that and still ended up either crashing 3DC or getting a black blob in its place which looks kind of like a shadow. Its either I'll have to reinstall 3DC or it maybe be something I'm doing wrong or missing in 3DC. Thanks for information though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted February 23, 2011 Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 Oh also be sure you're giving 3DC enough res. Try scaling up the model in your second screenshot or just hit the auto-scale button. Here's a cone shape, but it's too low res and looks like a blob. Here it is after scaling it up some: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 23, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 23, 2011 LOL, actually though the blob I'm talking about is in the last image I posted above. Its flat with no shape to it all and the default lighting seems to have no effect on it at all even when rotating the light source around it. Its like a black hole or a series of degenerate poly(s) or something. You maybe right about the size being too small to generate adequate voxels. In Lightwave though the text is about 26' wide but seems to come in very small in 3DC in comparison to the gizmo. I really have to zoom in just to see it. I'm sure I'm missing a step somewhere. I'll look over the video some more tonight to see where I went wrong. By the way great models. The first one though has my vote. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Yeah the size in LightWave doesn't mean anything in 3DC, since 3DC doesn't use any real world scale, inches, feet, etc. As you scale it up you can see an estimated poly count changing in the Tool Options panel. I'd say at least a couple hundred thousand should do it, if not you can always hit undo and scale it up some more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 24, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 I've got another question. What does it mean when you see 2x or 4x appear by the name in the layers panel? I see that the 2x appears in the video on all layers but I'm getting 4x instead on just one of the three layers I'm using. Does this have anything to do with size or volume? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted February 24, 2011 Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 When you first start, your layer is 1X (though it doesn't say so) so each time you increase the resolution for that layer the number will go up, 2X, 4X, 8X, etc. So it's just an indication of how high the resolution is for that layer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Beeavision Posted February 24, 2011 Author Member Report Share Posted February 24, 2011 Figured out what was causing the black hole effect. Apparently its an issue with the default shader if its even a shader at all after merging. Switching to another shader allows the object to be visible once again to the lighting. Well that's one down.... 40ty million to go. lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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