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AMD's CEO and CTO on Radeon VII, ray tracing and beyond


Carlosan
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I want to post this here because I'm on the threshold of pulling the trigger on my next rig (waiting for Radeon VII release and test results this week) and I'm thinking a lot about what is right to buy without going nuts/bankrupt on it. This is part of a longer conversation which I'll post, on GPU rendering with Redshift and Octane; the Entagma guys admire CPU rendering but it's becoming evident that it's just too slow. After their conversation on builds, one of the thread readers makes this comment, which I'd like to hold up for discussion;


Alex Fisher5 months ago
"I'm just gonna add something to the topic of having more gpus for lookdev with redshift specifically. As far as I know and have tested, when having data heavy scenes, it's actually better to have one gpu for rendering since the feedback time drops dramatically. I have tested a system with 8 GPUs and I can't stress enough how much longer it takes to load and refresh a scene with 8 GPUs. Since I've found this out last week, all that GPUs went into dedicated render rigs and I have 2 GPUs in my workstation, one for displaying stuff and one for rendering. Also, when using 1 frame per gpu rendering, you also gain farm speed since you optimise loading of scene files at different times. Love your videos guys
.

 

 

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On 2/5/2019 at 9:57 AM, AbnRanger said:

That's why you pre-order? I don't think they will stop at 5000 if they sell out quickly. That may just be their low-ball estimate. Who knows.

They might not want to produce more if it's been produced at a loss and the executive that made the decision to put it into production has left AMD/been driven out.

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https://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-vii-graphics-card-allocation-report-paper-launch/

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-radeon-vii-launch-allocation-100-units-for-uk-20-units-for-spain-and-france

A very limited edition


Only 76 units have made its way to OverclockUK headquarters. The OCUK allocation is supposedly half of what the UK will receive on launch day. And that is not the worst.

According to Cowcotland, Spain and France will get only 20 units each. It was not confirmed if the number came from one retailer or one manufacturer, but even if this meant 20 units from one manufacturer for one store the numbers are still unbelievably low.

The AMD Radeon VII will cost around 739 EUR in Europe. There is no information about availability in other regions, but early rumors indicated that only a few thousand units will be available worldwide at launch.

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5 hours ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

https://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-vii-graphics-card-allocation-report-paper-launch/

 

https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-radeon-vii-launch-allocation-100-units-for-uk-20-units-for-spain-and-france

A very limited edition


Only 76 units have made its way to OverclockUK headquarters. The OCUK allocation is supposedly half of what the UK will receive on launch day. And that is not the worst.

According to Cowcotland, Spain and France will get only 20 units each. It was not confirmed if the number came from one retailer or one manufacturer, but even if this meant 20 units from one manufacturer for one store the numbers are still unbelievably low.

The AMD Radeon VII will cost around 739 EUR in Europe. There is no information about availability in other regions, but early rumors indicated that only a few thousand units will be available worldwide at launch.

 

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I was just reading WCCF Tech and hit refresh and this popped up fresh off the press

https://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-vii-worlds-first-gaming-7nm-graphics-card-review-roundup/

 

I'm not really sold on this; I'm thinking the RTX2070 if you can find it with Samsung VRAM instead of Micron is probably a better deal, especially if you buy two of them. 

More troubling, we believe, is Radeon VII’s acoustic situation. Following in Nvidia’s footsteps, AMD retired its blower-style cooler in favor of one with axial fans. But rather than creating a quieter thermal solution able to keep Vega 20 cooler, Radeon VII is easily just as loud as the reference Radeon RX Vega 64 due to a fan curve that ramps up to 2,900 RPM under load. We approached AMD about Radeon VII’s noise because, frankly, it’s disappointing. The company explained that the card’s shipping configuration is tuned for enthusiasts, and that it’s working on other options that’d conceivably trade performance for better acoustics.

sold out.JPG

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Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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Just about what I thought!!! AMD Radeon VII is on par with the 2080 for gaming and normal graphics. In that regard, it also starts to pull away as you go up in resolution. So, on a 4k monitor, it will perform considerably better than the 2080. But on production benchmarks, as I mentioned, it generally puts the beatdown on even the 2080Ti! Especially in Blender (Cycles and ProRender) and LuxMark.

 

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35 minutes ago, haikalle said:

@L'Ancien Regime Do you know what 2070 cards have the better memory chips?

Very good question. We're going to have to research this.

 

https://forums.evga.com/Nvidia-has-updated-the-Reference-Founders-2080ti39s-to-utilise-Samsung-GDDR6-m2879642.aspx

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https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/1079421/geforce-rtx-20-series/rtx-2080ti-new-batch-gets-samsung-memory-/

 

 

Just watched that Linus video review. He seems to think the Radeon VII might be the ideal card for content creators..

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I've watched a few other reviews and most of them are focused on gaming benchmarks, and they are not very consistent. Some games are heavy in Radeon 7's favor, but the same game with another reviewer has it losing by a few frames. There seems to be no difference when rending video footage, as Premiere Pro isn't optimized for GPU's that well.

But, Linus and this guy seem to prove that the Radeon 7 beats even the 2080Ti when rendering in Blender. Part of that is AMD has done a lot of work with Blender Foundation, on Pro Render and Cycles. VRay is optimized more for CUDA, so V7 doesn't beat the 2080, there. As for the noise, I guess that is something to consider, but updated drivers will probably help improve the fan curve. It's only noisy under load, like gaming or GPU rendering. 

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8 hours ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

That's yesterday, new, off Ebay

 

ebay.JPG

That claim is NOT accurate...that you can get a 1080Ti for under $400. I shopped one last month, and have been checking the prices off and on, since. Even now, if you search for GTX 1080ti's on eBay, you're hard-pressed to find even used ones for less than $500. They usually go between $500-$600+, depending on the model. Some are more budget oriented, while others are meant for overclocking.

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After watching all those reviews, my previous assessment remains the same. FOR GPU RENDERING + OPENCL SIMULATIONS (Houdini), this is a BEAST and a heck of a value, when you consider the only thing close to it is a RTX 2080Ti...which costs $500 more. FOR A GAMING CARD....depends on whether you value the 16GB of Memory, for future-proofing purposes (knowing Game titles will only increase the RAM consumption more and more, as it becomes available on consumer cards), or the RTX that nobody uses yet, and may not, because there are software based solutions coming via DirectX and Vulkan.

If you want it, go get it...while you can.

https://www.amd.com/en/shop

 

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3 hours ago, AbnRanger said:

After watching all those reviews, my previous assessment remains the same. FOR GPU RENDERING + OPENCL SIMULATIONS (Houdini), this is a BEAST and a heck of a value, when you consider the only thing close to it is a RTX 2080Ti...which costs $500 more. FOR A GAMING CARD....depends on whether you value the 16GB of Memory, for future-proofing purposes (knowing Game titles will only increase the RAM consumption more and more, as it becomes available on consumer cards), or the RTX that nobody uses yet, and may not, because there are software based solutions coming via DirectX and Vulkan.

If you want it, go get it...while you can.

https://www.amd.com/en/shop

 

You pushed me over the cliff ya son of a gun. :D

I just pulled the trigger on that Radeon 7. I think one of the deciding factors is that it never was meant to be a gaming card. It's a cut down version of the Radeon Instinct, a scientific research card that sells for more than $10,000.00. It's got all the high end error correction stuff taken out which isn't necessary for artists so it won't be competing with the Instinct in that arena. I think this is going to be one hell of a lookdev card for sure at the very least.

 

$1059.43 in Canadian pesos.  Everybody else, even in the USA, was sold out except AMD themselves.  Delivery in 3-4 business days. And that's with the 3 games for free; not my type of gaming but nonetheless the aftermarket producers don't seem to be offering that deal, only the FE.

ONE PER CUSTOMER

newegg.thumb.JPG.cf76340ea9a3bbf1dc6158b2f33f187e.JPG

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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1 hour ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

You pushed me over the cliff ya son of a gun. :D

I just pulled the trigger on that Radeon 7. I think one of the deciding factors is that it never was meant to be a gaming card. It's a cut down version of the Radeon Instinct, a scientific research card that sells for more than $10,000.00. It's got all the high end error correction stuff taken out which isn't necessary for artists so it won't be competing with the Instinct in that arena. I think this is going to be one hell of a lookdev card for sure at the very least.

 

$1059.43 in Canadian pesos.  Everybody else, even in the USA, was sold out except AMD themselves.  Delivery in 3-4 business days. And that's with the 3 games for free; not my type of gaming but nonetheless the aftermarket producers don't seem to be offering that deal, only the FE.

ONE PER CUSTOMER

newegg.thumb.JPG.cf76340ea9a3bbf1dc6158b2f33f187e.JPG

Cool Beans. Let us know how well it simulates in Houdini (OpenCL). I'm very curious about that, as I'm thinking about getting back on Houdini Indie, soon. If you render in Blender, it should be comforting to know there isn't anything on the consumer card market better than that Radeon 7. That LuxMark test I did with the 1080Ti told me the V7 was going to be a beast at GPU rendering. I really hope to see Andrew have ProRender implemented in 3DCoat.

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https://www.ebay.ca/itm/NEW-AMD-Radeon-VII-7nm-Gaming-GPU-DirectX-12-HBM2-16GB-W-3-FREE-GAMES/183674854944?hash=item2ac3dfde20:g:bYkAAOSwF8BcXG~i:rk:1:pf:0

 

Somebody flogging off their review copy? It's got the 3 games included...

 

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Yessss...

 

https://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-vii-graphics-card-radeon-pro-software-enterprise-support/

 

All the reviewers are dumping on it but that didn't stop it from being sold out on day one. At $699 I wonder why that was? kek.

AMD-Radeon-Pro-Software-Drivers_Radeon-VII-1-1030x579.thumb.jpg.620818a91b415dfb3400b1a7e653491c.jpg

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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7 hours ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

Yessss...

 

https://wccftech.com/amd-radeon-vii-graphics-card-radeon-pro-software-enterprise-support/

 

All the reviewers are dumping on it but that didn't stop it from being sold out on day one. At $699 I wonder why that was? kek.

AMD-Radeon-Pro-Software-Drivers_Radeon-VII-1-1030x579.thumb.jpg.620818a91b415dfb3400b1a7e653491c.jpg

That's interesting. Makes it sort of sound like it's a Vega Frontier Edition 2.0. I don't care what the Game-Centric reviewers say about it, it's not underwhelming when you consider that it practically matches the 2080 in terms of gaming performance, and it's priced $100 less, retail. But for GPU rendering power, especially in Blender, it's the top dog in the yard. That's no small feat, considering how dominant NVidia has been the past 4-5yrs.

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I think it's too early to say who is going to win. Amd has a good gpu card now on the market and that's good thing. But I have seen quite nice results using nvidias RTX tech in renderer. I'm have been using both V-Ray and Redshift that are top apps
when it comes to rendering and yes, they support opencl but their focus seams to be all in RTX tech. I'm going to wait for my gpu card buy until I see benchmarks of RTX rendering. 

EDIT: redshift is cuda only, no opencl

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There are risks on both sides. If 2000 series weren't dying all the time I'd have gone with two 2070's months ago. But here we are and I can no longer delay. Making a choice means having to come to terms with the shortcomings of both platforms. Space invaders or a noisy fan, RTX or 16GB of  HBM2 VRAM and pro card drivers.  Even now just finding the RAM I want at 3600MHz by G. Skill is impossible; X399 specific sticks are almost all out of stock save for the 2933 16GB sticks. Getting the PSU I want is hard too. I've got to get this thing built though. I've waited long enough.

 

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2 hours ago, haikalle said:

@L'Ancien Regime Let us know when you get new radeon card how it performs with 3d-coat. I might jump to amd boat if it has a good perform in 3d apps overall.

I just grabbed this; it had the best reviews of all the 1200W PSUs on Amazon and NewEgg and I found one last new one in Vancouver for $280.00 Cdn. It's got 6 four pin 75V VGA sockets on it so I could feasably run 3 x Radeon VII cards with it.  I may get a second GPU. Not sure right now.  Considering that other PSUs rated this highly were over $500 I figure this is a good price point.

71U1vpz7-7L._SL1200_.thumb.jpg.53feecdf7ff73044b0d07240dc824018.jpgpsu.thumb.JPG.fad953f736233c3a67a4f55c6bffe47a.JPG

 

Auto Undervolt in the AMD Radeon Settings interface effectively deals with excessive fan noise.

 

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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26 minutes ago, L'Ancien Regime said:

I just grabbed this; it had the best reviews of all the 1200W PSUs on Amazon and NewEgg and I found one last new one in Vancouver for $280.00 Cdn. It's got 6 four pin 75V VGA sockets on it so I could feasably run 3 x Radeon VII cards with it.  I may get a second GPU. Not sure right now.  Considering that other PSUs rated this highly were over $500 I figure this is a good price point.

71U1vpz7-7L._SL1200_.thumb.jpg.53feecdf7ff73044b0d07240dc824018.jpgpsu.thumb.JPG.fad953f736233c3a67a4f55c6bffe47a.JPG

Definitely a good one, but I think you could have gotten a good 80Plus Gold PSU from a reputable company. Thermaltake, CoolerMaster, Antec, Corsair, Be Quiet, and EVGA are all good brands. This 1300W EVGA model is 80 Plus Gold and about $250

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817438011&ignorebbr=1

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Just now, AbnRanger said:

Definitely a good one, but I think you could have gotten a good 80Plus Gold PSU from a reputable company. Thermaltake, CoolerMaster, Antec, Corsair, Be Quiet, and EVGA are all good brands. This 1300W EVGA model is 80 Plus Gold and about $250

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817438011&ignorebbr=1

Yeah but that's $344 Cdn. That's an extra $64 for another 100W.  Remember, I'm buying all this stuff with worthless Canadian pesos as I slowly suffocate under a mountain of snow. 

Edited by L'Ancien Regime
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