Reputable Contributor digman Posted October 10, 2011 Reputable Contributor Share Posted October 10, 2011 You will be a 3Dcoat pro before long. The mirror looks excellent... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted October 10, 2011 Contributor Share Posted October 10, 2011 A gorgeous ensemble, sparkling new. Ambient Occlusion with a tarnished gold color and something to attenuate the perfection of the mirror (as per your suggestions) will make something of museum quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 10, 2011 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 10, 2011 A gorgeous ensemble, sparkling new. Ambient Occlusion with a tarnished gold color and something to attenuate the perfection of the mirror (as per your suggestions) will make something of museum quality. As I said I think I can make pretty good tarnish bloom between the glass and the mirror silver coat but irregular dust on the mirror..how to do that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted October 10, 2011 Contributor Share Posted October 10, 2011 A 'dusty material' controlled with an alpha channel so that only the edges of the mirror appear occluded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 11, 2011 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 11, 2011 A 'dusty material' controlled with an alpha channel so that only the edges of the mirror appear occluded. Like an alpha that's a circular gradient? I was thinking of doing this tutorial on how to put dust on glass; http://www.thegnomonworkshop.com/store/products/tutorials/jen_series/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted October 11, 2011 Contributor Share Posted October 11, 2011 A circular gradient may occlude more than necessary. I was thinking of a narrow gradient around the periphery of the plane or visible parts thereof. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 11, 2011 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 11, 2011 A circular gradient may occlude more than necessary. I was thinking of a narrow gradient around the periphery of the plane or visible parts thereof. hmm...not sure how to do that...just hand paint it with a spray brush? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted October 12, 2011 Contributor Share Posted October 12, 2011 Yes. The occlusion could even have minute scratches and your tiny signature down in the lower right corner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 13, 2011 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 13, 2011 So essentially my mirror project is complete with a few small alterations. I accomplished everything I set out to do and learned a lot of stuff along the way. In hindsight I think I would have taken the five constituent pieces of the mirror frame and retopoed them individually, and I would have AUTOPOed them too. I didn't like the errors that cropped up in AUTOPO but in retrospect I would have simply deleted the handful of offending polygons and replaced them by hand to remove the errors. I didn't realize that could be done. Now I do. I spent Monday and Tuesday worrying about the way the Normal and Displacement maps were working...they weren't smoothing out the base mesh, even though they were obviously having an effect. Finally on Tuesday afternoon after trying endless renders I found the SMOOTHING control in the OBJECT PARAMETERS panel of Maxwell Render. What joy. Today I just finished off hand painting all the repetitive geometrical ornament in Photoshop. Maybe I could have done it in 3d Coat but I knew how to do it in PS so that's how I did it. I feel it allowed for a lot more precision. I didn't have much faith in the Occlusion Map either...It looked ugly in Photoshop, lying there as a 2D map and frankly it looked pretty ugly in 3d Coat Paint Room too but in the event it was invaluable. It seemed to work like a meta pinch tool making everything more slender, less toylike. In the end I made it as a separate layer with 40% to the Occlusion Map and 60% to the Gold map. Also I want to offer thanks to digman for all the invaluable help he gave me. I honestly could not have completed this project (the most complex project I've made to date) without his generous and excellent advice. Thank you Digman. And finally I want to say one last thing about 3d Coat. There's a tendency for people to sort of scorn it, or say they like it's retopo tools but that's all. I disagree heartily. I've worked with Mudbox and I like it. It's good. And I've worked with Zbrush and I like it too. But 3d Coat is every bit as good as they are overall, and in some areas it's even better. Definitely it's ergonomic feel is superior. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted September 19, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted September 19, 2013 (edited) Well it's not complete after all. In fact when I tried to reopen and use this project in a render it really wasn't quite right at all (the displacement map was impossible to implement again) and this set me on a path of discovery in 3d coat. Originally I'd had to hand retopo this monster after I'd fused all its pieces into one big solid chunk. Big mistake. I paid for it with over a month of laborious hand retopo work. Crazy and stupid on my part. http://i.imgur.com/tRZ5K3N.jpg More recently with the coming of Andrew's new autopo and with the problems I was experiencing with my displacement map rendering properly I decided to get to work on learning how to get the most out of Autopo. With its convoluted multiple toroidial topology this particular model seemed to me to be the ultimate test for Andrew's algorithms. I took just the main frame layer and turned off the other accessories like the sphynxes and the scrollwork. Autopo in 6A worked really good, much better than back in Oct 2011, I was pleasantly surprised. But there were troubling anomalies that arose on closer inspection. It was almost like the surface wasn't even manifold http://i.imgur.com/flxGoDq.jpg http://i.imgur.com/uBx4Fcs.jpg I tried everything to try to rectify these messy problems but nothing seemed to work until finally the light went off over my head. There were big bubbles and invisible caves inside my voxel sculpt. Don't ask me how they got there, I can't think of anything I did to produce those. http://i.imgur.com/jnkHNnF.jpg http://i.imgur.com/Qik7HS2.jpg I'd had this problem in the past with UV mapping and finding all sorts of weird topology crumpled up in the corner of my UV maps which were in fact mapped surfaces of internal voxel bubbles, but I hadn't expected the problem to crop up here. So I played around with CLOSE INVISIBLE HULLS and then FILL VOIDS before hitting Autopo, (with edge loops! Edge loops work really well in 6A) http://i.imgur.com/go0Am4C.jpg The results, which while not quite perfect are almost perfect. After I closed Invisible Hulls and Filled Voids all the bubbles and caves in the voxel sculpt were gone. http://i.imgur.com/UX754Lb.jpg http://i.imgur.com/HUTG37w.jpg I mean being able to do an autopo on a convoluted topology like that just blows me away and the edge flow is superb for the most part. Remember, before you autopo, hit W and check for internal voids and hulls. So I got a much better autopo in 6A with no anomalies save for one minor one that was solely attributable to doing the autopo on Symmetry. http://i.imgur.com/TJ2V6xX.jpg http://i.imgur.com/0xyue2A.jpg But now I'm on the right road. This will be an easy problem to rectify I think. The next step is to try 7A on my cleaned up voxel sculpt and see if I can wrestle it into shape. The last attempt I made with 7A turned out like this; http://i.imgur.com/DEeemYp.jpg http://i.imgur.com/s0ZLdKl.jpg I think 7A can do a lot better than that if I just learn how to handle its controls and give it a decent manifold voxel sculpt to work with. With that garbage in the voxel model my computer would just hang for ages, not responding. Now it just blasts through the task in under 5 minutes, and that's with 110,000 polygons. Edited September 19, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Pix Jigsaw Posted September 20, 2013 Advanced Member Share Posted September 20, 2013 Thanks for sharing what worked and didn't work for you. Very good write up. I learned a lot. As always, I admire you work very much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted September 22, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted September 22, 2013 (edited) So I got sick and tired of trying to do a autopo mesh for the entire mirror in one go, and the hand retopo thing was an immense waste of time. Finally after a lot of experimentation I decided to strip away all ornament and just do the bare frame alone then add in the ornaments as individual merged layers. http://i.imgur.com/7NyGPUW.jpg And that allows me full reign to work in the greatest detail I could desire without technical compromises. You just have to work out for yourself what this medium can do. http://i.imgur.com/BEiRH65.jpg http://i.imgur.com/TnrzvZp.jpg 7A That's about 37k polys. Hell, I've got all the time in the world to render... Edited September 22, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted September 22, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted September 22, 2013 (edited) Now that I know that I can autopo everything to the level I wanted, and I've figured out Maxwell's autofocus so that I can swiftly even go in and use it as a macro lens if need be, it's nice to go back in and rework all the details to the standard that I originally desired. http://i.imgur.com/5Ex9ape.jpg Edited September 22, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted September 22, 2013 Contributor Share Posted September 22, 2013 Looking very good and your standard is impeccable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted September 22, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted September 22, 2013 Looking very good and your standard is impeccable. I'm really struck by how much autopo has improved since 2011. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted September 23, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted September 23, 2013 (edited) Just pulled a 8:00 AM Sunday to 7:00 AM Monday trying to get it all down to where I wanted it. I couldn't stop for anything, now that Autopo and yes auto UV and auto focus have just made my life fantastic. http://i.imgur.com/wA1M0MM.jpg I've cut up everything and I'm going back over it and reworking it where it needs it. http://i.imgur.com/NugcmvB.jpg The autopos with symmetry were terrible last night so I switched to non symmetry autopo and hand UV mapping. http://i.imgur.com/p3U6ipE.jpg Some problems to work out but basically I get to go to bed contented with a very enjoyable night. Edited September 23, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted September 23, 2013 Contributor Share Posted September 23, 2013 Such stamina and perserverance are beyond my imagining! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted September 28, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted September 28, 2013 (edited) So I pulled another all nighter last night from 8:30AM Friday to 5:30AM Saturday and as always it was because I couldn't stop having fun. This is like the book you can't put down, all you can do is keep turning the pages until the book is finished. In the process I discovered there's TWO kinds of normal maps http://i.imgur.com/33559zA.jpg I got the ambient occlusion going http://i.imgur.com/gvIwPNw.jpg Which in the final render on top of the gold layer with it's normal map and displacement map meant laying down the dirt occlusion as a diffusion map then reversing it to a negative with a lot of contrast to create a transparency map that masked it out so that it was largely transparent to the gold below allowing it to shine through everywhere where the dirt occlusion was not. If you'd seen all the outrageous messes that resulted from attempting this in the last two days you'd understand my relief and satisfaction when I finally made it work. And I finally wrestled control over the autopo/UVmapping/Rendering side of the game to the point where I could stop and say that this was what I wanted without any seams showing or any weird surface anomalies. Like this final step where I recalculated smoothing from 60.0 to 70.0 to smooth out those last annoying jaggies in the polygonal surface mesh. http://i.imgur.com/HfyFtuf.jpg http://i.imgur.com/onlRYjG.jpg Edited September 28, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted September 28, 2013 Contributor Share Posted September 28, 2013 Is the render in 3D-Coat? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted September 28, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted September 28, 2013 Is the render in 3D-Coat? Nope, Maxwell. Cycles gives great renders as Michaelis and digman have shown.. and it's free. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 2, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 2, 2013 (edited) http://i.imgur.com/arj1lOm.jpg working on the frame ornament, pushing to completion. Edited October 2, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted October 2, 2013 Contributor Share Posted October 2, 2013 Begs to be printed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 7, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) http://i.imgur.com/z6qL0jP.jpg Cakeller really knows his stuff...using the pose tool with airbrush as a masking tool worked great. http://3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=4075 http://i.imgur.com/YPt4qZV.jpg Edited October 7, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 12, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 12, 2013 http://i.imgur.com/9zN4058.jpg Messing around with some prototype boiserie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted October 12, 2013 Contributor Share Posted October 12, 2013 Quite gorgeous! Some ambient occlusion with a darker gold would enhance the detail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 12, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 12, 2013 Quite gorgeous! Some ambient occlusion with a darker gold would enhance the detail. Yeah there's a lot to do there. This isn't my new refurbished mirror, this is just the old hand retopo version and it's a nightmare to try to tweak out to render properly particularly the displacement map settings. I just took this as a break from finishing the detail on the mirror to play with this. The boiserie (boiserie goes right up to the ceiling while wainscoting only goes part way up the wall) is just a quick experiment. I knew that boiserie would be a complex architectural subject in itself. Boiserie is like an architectural concerto where you have an overall theme which gets elaborated upon in its varying details where different parts of the composition are dealt with according to certain rules, like the way it wraps itself around the chimney piece or the way it deals with corners, or doorways or windowsills. This panel I've simply repeated is like a leitmotif but in no way is the complete concerto, the rules of which I'm just starting to learn. But it's fun to play with. I've a more complete and elaborate wall panel in the works now, one that is more Louis XV in accordance with the style of the mantelpiece I've made. The new base panel has more sinuous, sculpted panel trim than these simple austere Georgian panels do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 14, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 14, 2013 (edited) http://i.imgur.com/vUJlvEC.jpg The new more elaborate model with variations for corner molding etc.. Creating space out of the void with light...this is real pleasure to me. 3d graphics is the best thing you can get into. For a thousand or two dollars you can get control over a virtual Hollywood or Cinecitta sound stage to do whatever you want. http://i.imgur.com/s0jgxAH.jpg http://i.imgur.com/IPtZSMa.png Cinecitta; http://www.cinecittastudios.it/en/studios/umbria-studios http://www.cinecittastudios.it/en/corporate-events# You've got Cinecitta sitting on your desk Edited October 14, 2013 by L'Ancien Regime 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Monkeybrain Posted October 23, 2013 Advanced Member Share Posted October 23, 2013 http://i.imgur.com/vUJlvEC.jpg The new more elaborate model with variations for corner molding etc.. Creating space out of the void with light...this is real pleasure to me. 3d graphics is the best thing you can get into. For a thousand or two dollars you can get control over a virtual Hollywood or Cinecitta sound stage to do whatever you want. http://i.imgur.com/s0jgxAH.jpg http://i.imgur.com/IPtZSMa.png Cinecitta; http://www.cinecittastudios.it/en/studios/umbria-studios http://www.cinecittastudios.it/en/corporate-events# You've got Cinecitta sitting on your desk it looks really great - like a photo For myself, I work on a rustical clock, I think that Krita is a good companion for 2D Details 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member L'Ancien Regime Posted October 24, 2013 Author Advanced Member Share Posted October 24, 2013 it looks really great - like a photo For myself, I work on a rustical clock, I think that Krita is a good companion for 2D Details http://krita.org/ Good find. thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Monkeybrain Posted October 24, 2013 Advanced Member Share Posted October 24, 2013 Yes, ok please ... but I recomend to use Krita in Linux. For myself I did made my computer dual boot able, its easy and fine. Krita did have even some better brush settings like photoshop and I didn't use corel painter anymore, why? Sorry for the offtopic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.