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Rygaard

5 top Key Features Missing for Artists in 3D-Coat (unfortunately do not exist)

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Hey everyone.

What I would like to talk about is very IMPORTANT.

I would like to share with you all 5 features (videos) that are very important and extremely essential in the sculpting process that unfortunately do not exist in 3D-Coat.
In all honesty, these 5 features, with all my experience, are urgent features that could be present for artists who use 3D-Coat to sculpt and detail their work.
I do not have words to describe how these 5 features would change our work within 3D-Coat.

I discovered that these features already exist and work perfectly in Blender.
And frankly, I am very sad to know that  these key features do not exist in 3D-Coat and would certainly make all the difference in our work.

I quit all my work, and for three days
consecutives, after a lot of work and a lot of effort (because I do not speak English fluently), I finally managed to do the 5 videos after many failures trying. Note: I tried to leave the videos with short durations and very objective.

I've done these videos demonstrating and explaining in the best possible way so that you can realize the importance of having these features urgently.
These videos are sorted and numbered by what I consider to be priorities for the top 5 features that do not exist in 3D-Coat.

Even after a lot of effort and work to make the videos, I know it will be worth it.
I believe and I hope that @Andrew Shpagin  will watch all 5 videos and realize how important it is to have these 5 important and essential features for 3D-Coat's Brushes and Alphas system for us artists.

In fact, the order of priorities would be:
1.Plane Offset - 2.Sample Bias - 3.Curve FallOff - 4.Size - 5.Adjust

---> 1. Plane Offset

---> 2. Sample Bias

---> 3. Curve FallOff

---> 4. Size

---> 5. Adjust


I've already emailed Andrew with these videos and I'm expecting some response.

Please, if you like and agree, help me to help you too, please contact Andrew asking for the implementation of these features.

Thank you very much for your attention.

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The only thing I can advise you is perhaps your advice will be ignored (as are my bug reports and the "do as in Blender" sentences (because there many things are extremely convenient and some are only there), so be patient.

Perhaps at the time of some religious apocalypse, some of them will be taken into consideration.

Edited by Sorda

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2 hours ago, Sorda said:

The only thing I can advise you is perhaps your advice will be ignored

I understand your positioning and the way you expressed yourself was even funny.

I want to believe that I am doing my part to help the community and maybe help 3D-Coat in development, even though I am aware of my limitations.

Perhaps, my voice can make a difference and become the voices of other people who would also like to be favored with a stronger 3D-Coat.
In the end, all people will be graced by these implementations.

Honestly, I would have my conscience heavy if I let it go and I did not do anything at all.

Do not get me wrong, 
but if Andrew and the developers do not listen to what their customers suggest or ask, then there would be no other way than buying the competing program and abandoning 3D-Coat. And I believe that this is not the case.

I have no contact with Andrew, I'm not a special contact, I'm not part of his team, despite all this, I think Andrew listens to me and analyzes if I have reason for the things I try to show him at point of view of an Artistic.
Because it is the artists who use the program and know the necessities that are essential to the accomplishment of a quality work.


I am a very private person and I do not like to comment on certain things. However, from some versions of 3D-Coat, I'm glad to see that some features that are present in the program, I have a certain participation. Including, bugs fixed!

I know Andrew does not respond to me sometimes, but he does the same with other people here in the community.
Maybe because the whole world will contact him, so he does not see my email that goes unnoticed ...  :(

Let's have faith!

I hope @Andrew Shpagin will get in touch about... the top 5 key features. :) 

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4 hours ago, Falconius said:

Regarding Plane Offset I'm not sure I understand how that differs from the depth control on most tools?

It's normal your doubt, most people also do not understand correctly and confuse about the relationship between Plane Offset and Strengh (Depth or Intensity).

At first, both functions seem to be identical, but in fact they are very different.

Imagine that the Brush is a sphere in which its volume influences the deformation of the surface of the mesh and in the middle of that sphere there is a center line or Plane.

The Plane is like an elevator that can be moved up or down relative to the surface of the mesh.
When moved (configured the value of the slide), the plane moves this sphere of influence into or out in relation of the mesh surface.

In Blender, the Brush size plus the Plane Offset = will define the boundary of the influence edges of the Brush deformation intensity.
Therefore, the Plane Offset will set the maximum distance that the Brush will pull or push the mesh to happen deformation.

The Strengh (Depth or Intensity), defines how fast you will reach this distance defined by the Plane.

The default value for Plane Offset is 0. This means that the Plane is at the same level as the mesh surface. Half of the sphere is inside and the other half is out of the mesh.

When we change Plane Offset to negative values, the plane will move the sphere of influence into the mesh resulting in a smaller deformation influence, that is, the Brush will have less deformation intensity on the mesh surface.
Even if you have a high Strengh (Depth) value, but with Plane Offset with a high negative value, you will have a deformation of the mesh surface that is null or very weak because the sphere of influence of deformation is inside the mesh.

Now, when we change the Plane Offset to positive values, the plane will move the sphere of influence out of the mesh resulting in an enormous deformation influence, that is, the Brush will have a greater deformation intensity on the mesh surface.

Of course there are several factors that influence on the deformation of the mesh like the sensitivity of the Tablet, FallOff, Alphas and other functions of the Brush system.

With the Plane Offset function you have full control of the influence of the deformation of the mesh. Refined Brush Control.
You can see in the Plane Offset video the benefits that this function provides for us artists.

I hope I have helped you to understand the difference between Plane Offset and Strengh (Depth).

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These are great suggestions, I didn't fully understand Plane offset, I understand how you are saying it works and the difference it has from the depth but, i still do not understand why it is better to do it with offset instead of depth when it seems to me to have the same effect.

Keeping in mind i am still learning about mesh and only recently purchased 3d coat.

I hope the team take on these ideas, thanks for taking the time to make the videos :)

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3 hours ago, Rygaard said:

I hope I have helped you to understand the difference between Plane Offset and Strengh (Depth).

Ah I understand, you explained it quite well.

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3DC user since 2007.

The development team and Andrew does listen to the artist input. I personally have seen down through the 12 years of using 3D Coat that the program has changed and grown through the feature request of many artist. Does every request get added to 3DC of course not and patience is needed if a feature request is added. 

3DC runs an open beta plus you as an artist can have a direct influence on the development. There is no closed beta here with only some inputs of a few artist. It is a not reasoned out conclusion to say that Andrew, the main developer does not listen to artist input.

Be respectable always, plus give good information on the reasons of the request. which Rygaard has done. 

All the above is not a endorsement of any feature but only some advice to any new artist who has recently purchased 3DC.

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Quote

Не поймите меня неправильно,  но если Эндрю и разработчики не прислушиваются к тому, что их клиенты предлагают или просят, то не останется другого пути, кроме как купить конкурирующую программу и отказаться от 3D-Coat. И я считаю, что это не так. 

Let's just say, an extreme update, like the appearance of a new person in the team, pleased me.

Moreover, I stopped breaking walls with a keyboard while trying to perform boolean operations. The fact that in version .25 would not have been fulfilled with a probability of 99%, yesterday it was successfully done and left me to sit with a stupid smile on my lips. Like, yes really.

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8 hours ago, Lizbot said:

These are great suggestions, I didn't fully understand Plane offset, I understand how you are saying it works and the difference it has from the depth but, i still do not understand why it is better to do it with offset instead of depth when it seems to me to have the same effect.

Keeping in mind i am still learning about mesh and only recently purchased 3d coat.

I hope the team take on these ideas, thanks for taking the time to make the videos :)

Hi Lizbot, thank you and welcome to the world of 3D-Coat! :)
Owww... you break me! I'm joking with you!

I've been in the same boat as you, in my way of learning I also had several doubts and confusions during my progress in 3D.
For me many features did not make sense and I did not understand why they existed.
Over time, you will gain experience with your practices, either through hits or through mistakes, and you will better understand how things work.

I would like to give you more explanations or technical terms, to try to make you understand better. However, I can only tell you that Strengh (detph) is different from Plane Offset.

I know this example is not the best, but imagine the following. You'll hammer a nail into the wall. Plane Offset is your limit of strength and Strengh is the intensity of your force that you will apply.

The Plane offset in addition to defining the limit of influence of deformation in the mesh, calculates the average of the Faces above and below.
This means that if you use values with negative numbers in the Plane Offset, the plane (spheres of influence) will descend (like an elevator) entering the mesh and because of this calculation of the average made of the faces above and below, in practice we will have a Brush with more controlled brushstrokes, with a better transition and smoothing at the moment of addition or subtraction in the deformation of the mesh.
When you set the plane, its intensity goes along with the plane, so logically the intensity will become weaker or not according to the positioning of Plane Offset.

Honestly, for you to understand better, you have to use the Plane Offset in conjunction with Strengh and experiment. Besides you feel, you will see the result that the functionality will provide you.

Blender's Plane Offset works in much the same way as the ZBrush's Imbed function. In my opinion, Plane Offset and Imbed are the same things. I think the only difference that exists between the two is that the ZBrush Imbed is more polished and has more features.

I was already forgetting to comment, but Strenth (Depth) with low intensity only seems to be similar with the functionality of Plane Offset with negative values, but I assure you Strengh (depth) is not the same as Plane Offset or that will provide you with the same benefits that Plane Offset will give you.

If anyone can help with a better explanation about Plane Offset or Imbed, please share with us. But right now it's the best I can do. I hope I have helped you understand better.

I agree with you, I hope that the developers provide us with these features that will surely make a huge difference in our work!
Please feel free to email Support by requesting these features. Thank you very much!

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One of the ways (apparently) to influence is to vote on the mantis for certain functions. Ask the moderator to add you there. 

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18 minutes ago, Sorda said:

Moreover, I stopped breaking walls with a keyboard while trying to perform boolean operations.

Sorry, but I can not stop laughing ... about your Boolean operation.

I'm not going to say that everything is perfect in developing a 3d program.
I think every version of 3D-Coat surprises me positively, but of course bugs happen, it's part of the development.

 

25 minutes ago, Sorda said:

One of the ways (apparently) to influence is to vote on the mantis for certain functions. Ask the moderator to add you there.  

Thanks for the tip! I think I'm already part of Mantis, I'll check it out!

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In 3D-Coat (Paint Room), we have features related to the Videos: Adjust and Size that I did.

One important thing to say is that there are features in 3D-Coat that I did not mention in the Adjust and Size Videos that would also be very important to the Alphas and Brushes system.

Related to the video - Adjust:
  In the Paint Room, we have:
      - Brightness / Contrast (located in the Textures / Adjust menu)
      - Hue / Saturation / Lightness (located in the Textures / Adjust menu)
      - Gama Correction (located in the Textures / Adjust menu)

 => Features that I did not mention in the Adjust video, but there are in Paint Room:
      . Curves (located on Smart Material)
      . Seed (located on Smart Material)
      . Invert (located in Smart Material)
      . Invert Color (located in the Textures / Adjust menu)
      . Sharpness (located on Smart Material)
      . Noise Curve, Noise Scale, Noise Degree (located on Smart Material)
      . Smooth (Smooth Current Layer) (located in the Textures / Adjust menu)
      . Sharpen (Sharpen Current Layer) (located in the Textures / Adjust menu)
      . Flip X (located in Preview Options)
      . Flip Y (located in Preview Options)
      . Distort Image (located in Preview Options)

Related to video - Size:
     In the Paint Room, we have:
      - TextureScale, but does not allow you to do the Stretch which would be the manipulation of individual values for Width and Height (located in Smart Material)

 => Features that I did not mention in Video Size, but there are in Paint Room:
       . Tilling (located in Preview Options)

635235461_functions_paint_room-related_to_Adjust_and_size_videos.thumb.jpg.1b190571a01c800a82f58f3819659376.jpg

What does that all mean?
I am not a programmer (developer), but what I would like to suggest is that the codes for many features are already ready (in a certain way).
Perhaps the implementation of a larger real-time preview in the Alphas / OptionsBrushes palette and the transition of these codes work in the 3D-Coat Sculpt Room Alphas or Brushes palette.

image.png.a4044a6d2d6ff4464ab6c30bb3f436c9.png

 

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Imbed is one of the most valuable control in zbrush (that by the way not many people know about..) it make you gain total control of the strokes (even with a mouse if you set the values correctly) so definately would be nice if 3d coat can have that (i didn't even knew blender had it... gotta give blender sculpt a try i guess)

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8 hours ago, JanvierPichon said:

Imbed is one of the most valuable control in zbrush (that by the way not many people know about..) it make you gain total control of the strokes (even with a mouse if you set the values correctly)

Blender's system of brushes and alphas is very similar to ZBrush's brushes and alphas system. Practically, all the important and essential features that an artist needs in the system of brushes and Alphas you find in Blender. The difference between Blender and ZBrush is that in ZBrush these features are more polished and the names of the features are different.

Very good your comment and thank you for your opinion.

I have worked hard to make these functionalities possible in 3D-Coat's Brushes and Alphas system.
I explained to @Andrew Shpagin  how much these features are essential and extremely important to the artists.

But the opinion of other artists who know these features is important for  @Andrew Shpagin to realize that everything I have said is true and has foundation.

8 hours ago, JanvierPichon said:

so definately would be nice if 3d coat can have that (i didn't even knew blender had it... gotta give blender sculpt a try i guess)

What you have said is important, it shows that for artists to use important functionality that does not exist in 3D-Coat (features that are essential and could exist in 3D-Coat), they need to exit 3D-Coat and use competing programs.
That's why many artists unfortunately give up using 3D-Coat's Sculpt Room and do their work on other programs.

Please, if you agree to all these features, strengthen this request by sending an email to support:
support@3dcoat.com
I do not know if other people have already done this, but I thank you all if you take 1 minute of your time and ask @Andrew Shpagin for these features. If possible, point to this topic to facilitate communication.

Thank you very much.

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Node based SmartMaterials. Give us this and see new user flock to 3d-Coat.
The Layering system is old and limiting.

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On 4/12/2019 at 3:12 AM, Werner_Z said:

Node based SmartMaterials. Give us this and see new user flock to 3d-Coat.
The Layering system is old and limiting.

I had already thought about suggesting this, and frankly, I do not remember commenting anywhere.
But from what I know and I informed myself about it, unfortunately the nodes system for Smart Materials would not be possible to do in 3D-Coat. I do not know if this has anything to do with the structure or architecture that was made in 3D-Coat.
It would be great and fantastic to have Nodes on Smart Materials ... and I agree with you.
I will try to ask again if it would be possible to implement this in 3D-Coat and have a more concrete answer, I'll let you know.

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