Auto Retopology Showcase and TIps

[Calabi]

I thought it might be an idea to have a thread where people can post auto retopologys they've done to kind of show it off, and give tips, try and uncover the mysterys of it. It might help develop it and advertise it.

I know I could not manually get retopo as good as this(I'm liking it alot). Got it through increasing the density around the eyes/nose area and guiding the edgeflow around that area. I did have to move the edges by the nose, they were a bit further back(perhaps thats a bit too thin, angle to great?).

[Pimpmymonkey]

I thought it might be an idea to have a thread where people can post auto retopologys they've done to kind of show it off, and give tips, try and uncover the mysterys of it. It might help develop it and advertise it.

I know I could not manually get retopo as good as this(I'm liking it alot). Got it through increasing the density around the eyes/nose area and guiding the edgeflow around that area. I did have to move the edges by the nose, they were a bit further back(perhaps thats a bit too thin, angle to great?).

Wow...Beautiful Retopo!!!

And a thread for this is brilliant as well.

Thanks,

P. Monk

[Calabi]

Wow...Beautiful Retopo!!!

And a thread for this is brilliant as well.

Thanks,

P. Monk

Thanks, I wasnt sure if it was a good idea or not. I'll probably have another go at the skull, I should be able to get it a bit better.

[Tony Nemo]

I see a bit of Add & Split but don't be obsessive. If an object is to be deformed in animation, certain areas may need extra attention but it's hard to see where a skull would need more.

[Calabi]

Yeah, will do, thanks Tony.

I did a little compare, first one is without guidelines. I've noticed if you have one guideline then you have to have guidelines for all areas, because it can throw it off, it uses those guidelines to define the whole object I guess. I didnt increase any areas the whole thing is about 6000 polys.

[Tony Nemo]

I see that the mesh conforms to the distance between the spline points (I haven't used the tool). I am curious about what would occur in the mesh if your spline was at the very edge of the nasal cavity. I also notice the perfect alignment in the first image.

[Calabi]

I see that the mesh conforms to the distance between the spline points (I haven't used the tool). I am curious about what would occur in the mesh if your spline was at the very edge of the nasal cavity. I also notice the perfect alignment in the first image.

That first image was after I manually moved the points. I've tried moving the spline really close to the edge it doesnt work.

[michalis]

Is there a way to know how many tris or 5gones exist in a retopo mesh? An indicator maybe. If someone plans to rebuild a multi-res mesh in another app (zbrush, blender) the existence of other than quad faces is not acceptable.

[Taros]

Is there a way to know how many tris or 5gones exist in a retopo mesh? An indicator maybe. If someone plans to rebuild a multi-res mesh in another app (zbrush, blender) the existence of other than quad faces is not acceptable.

To eliminate n-gons and tris in the retopo result is one of the topics Andrew is working on. What you see currently is still beta.

[Psmith]

Michalis:

Concerning this particular example of a non-animating model, why are neither triangles nor n-gons acceptable to you? Is there a particular problem that arises for you that is caused by the presence of triangles or n-gons?

It would be helpful if you could show, graphically, why this presents a problem in Zbrush or Blender.

Greg Smith

[wailingmonkey]

not trying to speak for michalis, but this is what greets you in Z4 when you've got a retopo with n-gons:

(see image---check n-gon next to 6-sided vert)

[michalis]

Concerning this particular example of a non-animating model, why are neither triangles nor n-gons acceptable to you? Is there a particular problem that arises for you that is caused by the presence of triangles or n-gons?

This is a good question, a great one IMO.

Lets say, I'll start some basic sculpture using voxels, then retopo, then to zbrush for fine sculpture.

This is not the case. Its better to sculpt as more as I can in voxels room, then go for retopo. Because I know this way what details matter more what less. Fine tuning in retopo room, thats what I like to do. This way, I'll have some great details in zbrush, even using 30-100k meshes. If I choose to use auto-retopo then 1M or more mesh should expected. If so, zbrush autoretopo seems almost the same. OK, not exactly but close.

@wailingmonkey, exactly so, here we have a problem that always causes artifacts. Not acceptable.

I could export a simple tri mesh directly from voxel room and do some more sculpture in zbrush. If the subject is an ancient sculpt then artifacts could look like aged marble texture. Lets avoid solutions like this last one.

I have to say this too. IMO, all nice topologies with loops etc can be described as a simple tri model that is subdivided to quads. Very difficult to have snap working using this method. Unfortunately!

As a digital sculptor, I need some precise topology. What's happening in the industry of VG is not my concern. Sorry. Sorry for my english too.

To eliminate n-gons and tris in the retopo result is one of the topics Andrew is working on. What you see currently is still beta.

I know, but my wish is to see all these tri and ngones painted in red or something similar.

[michalis]

Concerning this particular example of a non-animating model, why are neither triangles nor n-gons acceptable to you? Is there a particular problem that arises for you that is caused by the presence of triangles or n-gons?

This is a good question, a great one IMO.

Lets say, I'll start some basic sculpture using voxels, then retopo, then to zbrush for fine sculpture.

This is not the case. Its better to sculpt as more as I can in voxels room, then go for retopo. Because I now know what details matter more what less. Fine tuning in retopo room, thats what I like to do. This way, I'll have some great details in zbrush, even using 30-100k meshes. If I choose to use auto-retopo then 1M or more mesh should expected. If so, zbrush autoretopo seems almost the same. OK, not exactly but close.

@wailingmonkey, exactly so, here we have a problem that always causes artifacts. Not acceptable.

I could export a simple tri mesh directly from voxel room and do some more sculpture in zbrush. If the subject is an ancient sculpt then artifacts could look like aged marble texture. Lets avoid solutions like this last one.

I have to say this too. IMO, all nice topologies with loops etc can be described as a simple tri model that is subdivided to quads. Very difficult to have snap working using this method. Unfortunately!

As a digital sculptor, I need some precise topology. What's happening in the industry of VG is not my concern. Sorry. Sorry for my english too.

[Taros]

...

I know, but my wish is to see all these tri and ngones painted in red or something similar.

This could be a good workaround as long as this problems exists. But I guess, as long as Andrew believes that he can manage this, we will have to wait for a solution and live with it. If a auto retopo mesh have less polys, then it is easy to correct this problems by hand, but if someone is working with high poly meshes, then a soon solution is needed here.

[robotbob]

'I know, but my wish is to see all these tri and ngones painted in red or something similar. '

yes i think this makes sense, its a good idea.

sorry this is no doubt a stupid question but is the latest auto retopo only in the beta or in the released version ?

pete

[Calabi]

I cant get this object to work for some reason, thought it might be the file and that its because its with another object that has been retopoed, so I isolated it, but it still wouldnt work.

[michalis]

IMO, an indicator of non quads faces is much more important than auto-retopo methods. A method to assign edge loops to any quad group I like seems an add of great importance to me.

[AbnRanger]

I cant get this object to work for some reason, thought it might be the file and that its because its with another object that has been retopoed, so I isolated it, but it still wouldnt work.

I had a model that was doing the same thing....wouldn't work no matter what steps I took. I sent it to Andrew and upon further examination, he said the model was too complex internally (I think I had created a hull/shell of the object (in attempt to keep the voxel density down). To rectify that, I'd have to do some kind of work around like export the model and remerge it back in, as there is no way for 3DC to fill a structure, currently. Maybe a primitive that surrounds it and then do an intersection. I don't know if that is similar to what is going on with your model, but you may want to send a copy of it to Andrew and let him take a look at it.

[Calabi]

Thanks AbnRanger you were right. I had a hole, filled it and was fixed.

Result. Looks as if it got a bit confused. The auto retopo will definitely need to be guided. Perhaps it would be an idea if it ignored surface details(heights) within certain ranges.

[robotbob]

its a bit frustrating, this vimeo clip shows the auto routine in nice crisp definition BUT you cant see where the functions are getting pulled form the menu.

does anyone know of a good auto retop guide that shows actual menus ?

pete

[Psmith]

Robot Bob:

These videos were made just prior to Siggraph, and were made with a prototype version of 3D-Coat, probably having no menu items. Now, to invoke these functions, plus the function of defining which areas of the AUTOPO mesh are most dense, you open a kind of "wizard" that leads you through the process, step by step. (Some people like the wizard, other's don't).

So, after creating or importing something into the Voxel Room, right click on the Voxel layer in the Vox Tree where you want to run the AUTOPO algorithm and select "Quadrangulate object" - and the wizard begins it's magic, asking you, first, to estimate the total number of polygons you want to shoot for, (actual numbers may vary), and then to "shade" those areas of the sculpture you wish to contain the largest density of polygons.

After you have done this by left clicking to add dense areas and Ctrl-left clicking to erase them, you are asked to draw some reference curves which help the algorithm determine where to place edge loops. I suggest lowering the "spline points density" slider, (in top right menu bar), for long and large curves. Raise the slider amount back up for small areas like fingers.

Click "Next" when you're done, and the rest is automatic. Go to the Retopo Room to see and manipulate the result.

Greg Smith

[robotbob]

thanks for the reply, much appreciated. its kind of weird to have some of this fantastic functionality around but some difficulty in finding where it is. which makes your reply very valuable. thanks again.

[AbnRanger]

its a bit frustrating, this vimeo clip shows the auto routine in nice crisp definition BUT you cant see where the functions are getting pulled form the menu.

does anyone know of a good auto retop guide that shows actual menus ?

pete

Sorry about that...I'll post one here shortly. I wanted to wait a bit to do one as the tool is still being refined, and some of my own experiments haven't given the kind of results you'd expect. It's about 80% there, but even with guides properly placed, I still get some trouble spots that make it hard to decide whether to spend the time to fix it or just do it manually from scratch.

[philnolan3d]

I believe Javis (geothefaust) said he is also going to make an official Retopo video as well.

[Calabi]

Just had a mess about with a face.

[robotbob]

first auto retopo experiment. I wont clean it up as the model is nowhere near ready for that, but i just wanted to see how it works.

Its definitely a decent start, but ill have to see how easy it is to stitch in manual retop work.

[Hugues Riopelle]

hello sorry distub you, I'm a new user with 3d coat. I try to use guide line or strokes with quadragulate object. It not working for me. I read all message in this topic. I follow this step and the wizard ask me only (Millions of polygones and normal smoothing) number after that I go automaticly in the repto section with the polygon object. The wizard don't ask me to add reference curves or noting else....

I check this video and http://vimeo.com/14816574 and this not work for me.

I have 3d coat 3.3.08 and I run this software on a Imac27 i7 8 gig ram.

Somebody can help me PLEASE ? 8oP

Hugues Riopelle

These videos were made just prior to Siggraph, and were made with a prototype version of 3D-Coat, probably having no menu items. Now, to invoke these functions, plus the function of defining which areas of the AUTOPO mesh are most dense, you open a kind of "wizard" that leads you through the process, step by step. (Some people like the wizard, other's don't).

So, after creating or importing something into the Voxel Room, right click on the Voxel layer in the Vox Tree where you want to run the AUTOPO algorithm and select "Quadrangulate object" - and the wizard begins it's magic, asking you, first, to estimate the total number of polygons you want to shoot for, (actual numbers may vary), and then to "shade" those areas of the sculpture you wish to contain the largest density of polygons.

After you have done this by left clicking to add dense areas and Ctrl-left clicking to erase them, you are asked to draw some reference curves which help the algorithm determine where to place edge loops. I suggest lowering the "spline points density" slider, (in top right menu bar), for long and large curves. Raise the slider amount back up for small areas like fingers.

Click "Next" when you're done, and the rest is automatic. Go to the Retopo Room to see and manipulate the result.

[Grandmaster B]

Somebody can help me PLEASE ?

You need version 3.3.14 or the upcoming 3.5 version (will be released very soon i guess).

Here are the latest beta builds:

http://www.3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=5789

EDIT: Oh, i see 3.5 is just there

[Hugues Riopelle]

Oh ok, I pass One hour try do gude line with the wrong version hehehe, I download the version 3.5 and it work great! Thanks you for your help!

Hugues

You need version 3.3.14 or the upcoming 3.5 version (will be released very soon i guess).

Here are the latest beta builds:

http://www.3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=5789

EDIT: Oh, i see 3.5 is just there

[nounouvert]

@ michalis: zbrush autoretopo?