Sculpting apps vs traditional poly modelling

[existe]

So quick question, and please forgive my amount of not knowing. I am currently learning C4D to do traditional polygon modelling and its going ok but I hit a ton of roadblocks in trying to create what I can draft up in my head or on paper. I am a hobbyist, mainly creating still images (hard surface modeling with some organic) and occasionally create a mograph animation. I have never done any sculpting but have started to poke around into the applications themselves and it just appears on the surface that sculpting seems a tad bit easier as an artist to get something completed without having to worry so much about the technical polygon stuff in say C4D.

I somewhat understand bringing the mesh into C4D and having to retopo for various reasons, but if all I am looking to produce are still images is a sculpting app a better avenue? I understand the importance of understanding the traditional polygon modelling route but my goal is never to be in the industry or produce assets. Really trying to figure out if perhaps learning a sculpting application is where I should be focusing the attention to produce what I want or continue to learn the traditional modelling application and pick up sculpting in addition. Opinions an guidance appreciated. Thanks.

[The Candy-floss Kid]

Sculpting apps allow you to freely experiment with designs without polygonal commitment. Hard surface object creation is also easy with decimation and polygon crunching. Retopology of designs do require polygonal workflow understanding.

If you're an experienced polygonal modeller following designs previously worked in 2d - the speed advantages offered by sculpting are far more minimal. In this sense you are creating polygonal models with focused purpose without the need for later retopology.

Being familiar with both modes of working will allow you freedom to create work much faster.

[Carlosan]

http://forums.cgsociety.org/archive/index.php/t-1069094.html

[puntoit]

I guess if you just want too beautyful pictures as a hobby the answer is going to give your hardware. The amount of polygons created thruogh sculpting can easily reach several millions and may therefore render much longer than carefully placed polygons. This is also the reason why most people do a retopology after sculpting.

[Amos]

Yeah, also sculpting hardsurface elements is challenging. When trying to acheive the same results you would get in c4d, max or maya. You can do it, but it depends on what you want really.

[geo_n]

You will always have to gain skills in poly modelling because retopo needs knowledge in poly flow.

Sculpting is fast for organic objects and frees up creativity. But to retopo these sculpts take a lot time, too, sometimes as long as creating models in polygons.

Hardsurface modelling is a no no for scultping apps imho especially when dealling with precision. The retopo mesh is going to be crooked compared to what you get out of poly modelling. Try to retopo a simple box with 8x8 segments, its not going to be as perfect as in a polymodeller.

Autoretopo is a last resort for me. Mesh is too messy.

[popwfx]

In this discussion, what would you suggest for the reverse situation - where the user is very experienced with poly modeling, but not so much with sculpting? What is the best way to learn sculpting when you've already mastered poly (and spline) modeling?

Edited May 29, 2013 by photonvfx

[digman]

General tips

First, start out with a low voxel count object to get a feel for the brushes, You can doodle away very fast that way... It's like sketching with a pencil in your notebook, the more you do the better you get and gains you valuable experience when you do a real project. Lots less frustrations that way.

Once you get a feel for how voxels plus surface mode / LC brushes work, then you can move on to higher detail objects.

Since you are an experienced modeller in the back of your mind you will always be thinking about edge flow even before retopoing your voxel sculpt. That is a big plus as we are still bound to good polygon topology for the end result though we now have the freedom to make our creation first, then build good polygon edge flow on top of it...

Meet me on Skype sometime and I will give you a few pointers to get you started...

[wave of light]

I can certainly vouch for Digman's Skype sessions, and suggested workflow. helped me out a lot with a model I was doing and gave me a better understand of the Voxel tools inside 3DC (I was mainly using 3DC for texture work).

[AbnRanger]

So quick question, and please forgive my amount of not knowing. I am currently learning C4D to do traditional polygon modelling and its going ok but I hit a ton of roadblocks in trying to create what I can draft up in my head or on paper. I am a hobbyist, mainly creating still images (hard surface modeling with some organic) and occasionally create a mograph animation. I have never done any sculpting but have started to poke around into the applications themselves and it just appears on the surface that sculpting seems a tad bit easier as an artist to get something completed without having to worry so much about the technical polygon stuff in say C4D.

I somewhat understand bringing the mesh into C4D and having to retopo for various reasons, but if all I am looking to produce are still images is a sculpting app a better avenue? I understand the importance of understanding the traditional polygon modelling route but my goal is never to be in the industry or produce assets. Really trying to figure out if perhaps learning a sculpting application is where I should be focusing the attention to produce what I want or continue to learn the traditional modelling application and pick up sculpting in addition. Opinions an guidance appreciated. Thanks.

If all you are doing is stills or even rapid prototyping, Modeling with Voxels is the way to go for most modeling tasks. The freeform primitives are very NURBS-like, in that you can simply manipulate some control points to affect the entire shape, and it's more forgiving than any other form of modeling I can think of. Booleans are a piece of cake and carefree...not so in polygonal modeling apps. 3ds Max has a nice set of Booleans tools (they bought a 3rd part plugin that was exceptional at the task), but even that leaves a lot of cleanup to do, and some nasty geometry here and there.

With the Vertex/Voxel Painting, you don't need to fool with Retopo work or UV's....just export the model from the Voxel Room (FBX or PLY are two good options) and enable Vertex Color maps in your viewport and then use a Vertex Color map in place of your Diffuse channel within your shader.

Vertex/Voxel Painting

Exporting Models with Vertex Color

[AbnRanger]

You will always have to gain skills in poly modelling because retopo needs knowledge in poly flow.

Sculpting is fast for organic objects and frees up creativity. But to retopo these sculpts take a lot time, too, sometimes as long as creating models in polygons.

Hardsurface modelling is a no no for scultping apps imho especially when dealling with precision. The retopo mesh is going to be crooked compared to what you get out of poly modelling. Try to retopo a simple box with 8x8 segments, its not going to be as perfect as in a polymodeller.

Autoretopo is a last resort for me. Mesh is too messy.

I disagree on this score. If you think about it, most of the tools you'd use in a 3D modeling app are available right in the Voxel Workspace. The only ones that are not, pertain to piddling with verts and edges....no piddling with those in 3D Coat. Just get used to the equivalent tools (ie, Primitives, Freeform Primitives, Curves tool, Pose tool...which is a Modeling Swiss Army knife, and all the selection modes in the E-Panel...especially the Splines). Once you're proficient with those, you'll know how to do the same tasks in Voxels. There are some advantages to modeling in a standard 3D Modeling app (little more control in some areas like beveling and such), but conversely, there are things I can do in minutes with Voxels that would take me hours to do in a traditional modeling app. I loved 3ds Max's modeling tools but I hardly ever touch it anymore. I model almost exclusively in 3D Coat.