Advanced Member michalis Posted November 5, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 5, 2010 OK it works here, you probably have to choose the appropriate layer. (OSX) But it does this, what are these squared artifacts? Update: It happens on more dense quads areas. No UV stretching or seams there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted November 6, 2010 Contributor Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Yes and the tools not following the default brushes is also still not fixed. It looks like they're being cut off at the top. As if you used the round brush (pen alpha) and then used the flatten tool on top of it. Its not gonna be fixed I think,because it seems its the nature of the new brush engine itself: The current algorithm of brushes is rather like PS/ZB/MB - sequential blending together many spaced alphas. It makes tops of "hills" more planar than alpha "hill" is. Ok Andrew,I tested SF mode in 3.4.4B. "sharp shape" option works great but "initial vertex normal " method is missing from rollout for workflow to work, "average normal" method does not gives nice results when stroke overlaps. -Flatten backfacing problem is fixed. -Also black holes problem seems fixed on my side. I wasnt able to get any. Only some spikes and those were hard to get...I cant identify what kind of stokes really creates them. I sculpted a lot today in both engines and here is my final verdict on SFmode and new engine. Its a hard judgment but to me it seems to benefit only Draw brush. Draw brush was a very bad brush (compared to its voxel counterpart "airbrush") But with new engine it became a very good brush. All other brushes feel less good in new engine IMO. Anyway,I thought all other brushes had already a very good feeling. The sculpting feeling in SurfaceMode was great really,very smooth and good brush behaviors too. What was really missing to be complete IMO is strength slider for Move brush and Flatten brush . (of course new engine seems awesome for painting) Also,another very important thing ,try to set spacing to 5%-10% in older engine ,you will see a strange phenomenon like a "super softstroke",very nice feeling, even better than original soft stroke itself. Please try it,you will understand.(Its very strong effect) It feels like Zbrush lazymouse or mudbox Steadystroke. Problem is now in new engine that effect is gone. (but maybe effect was unintentional in the beginning anyway ) But if you were able to reimplement this in some ways it would be cool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor artman Posted November 6, 2010 Contributor Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 What are they saying to you? ...And how does that make you feel (<what a Psychologist would say)? Its the first computer that i have that does this. If I have headphones plugged in and no music playing I can hear all the cpu operations in the headphones. A little bit like morse code....its very strange Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Metromot Posted November 6, 2010 Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Still can't use Color Tool in .04 PPP, does any Mac user having this problem or it's just me? http://www.3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=6904 Other than that, I just want to say ---- THANK YOU!!! same problem here V 3.5.04, IMac 2010 i5 3.6 GHz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member bona Posted November 6, 2010 Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Thank you Metromot, hope this will be fixed in next build. Though we could use layer blending to replace this tool, I'm sure Andrew doesn't want such bug hanging around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted November 6, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 The different behavior of tools between OSX 10.5.8 and 10.6.4 indicates that probably a mouse or tablet conflict is happening. Not the first time I see mouse problems in builds (blender, they fixed it though) I mean lot of 3DC hangs happened exactly when using these devices in the past. Just an idea Andrew. But I didn't notice memory leaks so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I tested out the SharpShape check box and it's interesting. It does fix the brushes so that they work properly. The odd part to me, is why you need a check box. Why would you ever want them to not work properly? Plus, it only works with some tools and only in voxel sculpting. If it's going to be an option, it should at least be available everywhere, painting room too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted November 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 OSX build 3.5.04B re-uploaded Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted November 6, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I'm afraid to download it. OK, what is fixed then? Please give us some information Andrew, please. What to check for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted November 6, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Update: it works fine, thanks Andrew. Brushes are working fine, with the exception that artman mentioned. It seems that masks work like knockout masks, no grey. Just a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applink Developer haikalle Posted November 6, 2010 Applink Developer Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I tested out the SharpShape check box and it's interesting. It does fix the brushes so that they work properly. The odd part to me, is why you need a check box. Why would you ever want them to not work properly? Plus, it only works with some tools and only in voxel sculpting. If it's going to be an option, it should at least be available everywhere, painting room too. I agree. I personally don't like if a brush gives diffrent result from its alpha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted November 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I'm afraid to download it. OK, what is fixed then? Please give us some information Andrew, please. What to check for example. It is just updated to same version as Windows, see changes above. Mac specific change - "Change color" tool works properly there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted November 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I agree. I personally don't like if a brush gives diffrent result from its alpha. Try to open PS, load some alpha. Use default spacing 0.25. Draw stroke. Alpha will be applied in the same was as now in 3D-Coat. You may y same in ZB or MB. All they use same method as I discovered. Checkbox is add there just to be able to work in old - style way. Also, default brushes in MB ZB work rather like Draw/airbrush in 3DC now. Old "following" effect described by Artman can be now done by decreasing spacing and using Interpolate (Soft stroke). The only missing thing - Extrude in vertex normal direction with old style alpha usage will be recovered in next build. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Try to open PS, load some alpha. Use default spacing 0.25. Draw stroke. Alpha will be applied in the same was as now in 3D-Coat. You may y same in ZB or MB. All they use same method as I discovered. Checkbox is add there just to be able to work in old - style way. Also, default brushes in MB ZB work rather like Draw/airbrush in 3DC now. The only brushes I have a problem with are the default 6 And you can't open those in Photoshop. Edit: Oh no I'm wrong I do have the problem with other brushes, including the .ABR brushes I loaded from Photoshop. So I don't understand what you're asking me to do in the above quote. Load the alpha in PS? Edit again: Oh I think I see, you're saying here that the same brush will work the same way in 3DC and PS now. If that's the the case I couldn't make that happen. Here I used the same brush in both 3DC and Photoshop. 25% spacing in PS with everything else at the default. I used the brush in 3DC, then used Edit in External Editor and used it in PS. Not to mention what works in Photoshop may not work for sculpting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted November 6, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 OK Andrew, still testing. I really don't know what you have done for the mac build but please. SAVE THIS. Performance is tremendous now. It performs same or even better than zbrush. I sculpted this simple nonsense LOL, at 10 min. As I said performance is tremendous. So close to real sculpture. Thank you sir. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member kbrilliant Posted November 6, 2010 Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I'm also enjoying the speed and feel of the voxel engine. The only thing I'm experiencing is using the stamp brush mode in surface sculpting mode. It doesn't seem to work with the draw, clay, inflate brushes, and there is that flattened clipping happening with the others (in surface and stamp mode). Is this on purpose? Forgive me if this has been addressed already. I've tried to read most of the posts here, but there are so many. Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member bona Posted November 6, 2010 Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Color Tool in PPP fixed, thank you Andrew. Noticed a change in 3.5.04B, after Autopo, it always generate 2 groups of the same name, one of them with mesh in it and the other is empty, is this a bug? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Hirazi Blue Posted November 6, 2010 Member Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 After getting around installing 3.5.04A on Vista x64, something odd happened: the first time I started the program it welcomed me in English, as I have come to expect. The second time I started it however it opened in another language / font I couldn't decipher. Then, the third time and every time since (so far) it opened in English again... Weird, especially as it didn't happen the first time I opened this version of program... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 I'm also enjoying the speed and feel of the voxel engine. The only thing I'm experiencing is using the stamp brush mode in surface sculpting mode. It doesn't seem to work with the draw, clay, inflate brushes, and there is that flattened clipping happening with the others (in surface and stamp mode). Is this on purpose? Yes this is apparently on purpose, it's what I and others have just been talking about. We can't really understand why though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psmith Posted November 6, 2010 Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Andrew: I've had the same difficulty with most of the "Surface" Brushes - there seems to be definite and restricted "ceiling", where all alpha shapes are ignored and a flattening or clipping occurs at the completion of a set of strokes. I believe that all brushes, whether they are genuine voxel brushes or "Surface" brushes, should respect the shape of the alpha - at any depth setting. Otherwise, there is no point in using the alpha shapes at all. If user defined brush curves are ever implemented in the brush engine, then, perhaps alphas will become unnecessary for everything except brush "stamping". But, alpha shaped brushes are definitely easier to create and modify than curves for most general purpose sculpting tasks. Greg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Applink Developer haikalle Posted November 6, 2010 Applink Developer Report Share Posted November 6, 2010 Try to open PS, load some alpha. Use default spacing 0.25. Draw stroke. Alpha will be applied in the same was as now in 3D-Coat. You may y same in ZB or MB. All they use same method as I discovered. Checkbox is add there just to be able to work in old - style way. Also, default brushes in MB ZB work rather like Draw/airbrush in 3DC now. Old "following" effect described by Artman can be now done by decreasing spacing and using Interpolate (Soft stroke). The only missing thing - Extrude in vertex normal direction with old style alpha usage will be recovered in next build. Thanks for sharing this info Andrew. I don't own PS so I don't know how does it behave there. But as a artist I'm not a fan of that flatness behaviour. All those circle alphas (up row) behaves almost like one brush. But maybe I need just time to adapt myself and find new tricks to do things. Maybe it's bit tricky because in 3d-coat you can paint color and normals. For colors this new engine is just fine. When painting normals, it's important to have right alpha shape. I would like to paint ropes, strings (things that has round shape) in paint mode as a normal paiting. But like I said before all the rest in new engine is pure magic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member kbrilliant Posted November 7, 2010 Member Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 Perhaps since this is a beta, I shouldn't heap on more comments. But I am a bit confused at the various conditions of the brushes and modes. For example, the strips feature doesn't seem to work in voxel mode, but it does in surface mode, while the stamp mode works in voxel and not in surface. Consistency in the way tools perform will go a long way in ease of use and enjoyment. It get's to be a bit tiring to keep these conditions in mind and switch back and forth. Lastly, the flatten brush has problems in that it jumps all over the surface. I'm excited about the developments, though, and look forward to their continued refinement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Mykyl Posted November 7, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 The only things I am noticing are it is MUCH faster now but there is lots of faceting that was not there before. Not really an issue unless you are rendering within 3d coat itself I guess. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted November 7, 2010 Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 The only things I am noticing are it is MUCH faster now but there is lots of faceting that was not there before. Not really an issue unless you are rendering within 3d coat itself I guess. Mike Are you using one of the new Derpth Shaders? Like This vs. This? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member michalis Posted November 7, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 The renderer (r-room) stops at 210 samples. Minor issue of course. I'm impressed with this new beta. I saved it LOL. I was working all night, I tried as much I could. Even UVs and baking performance is much faster and seems stable. (the Mac build). I personally don't complain about behavior of tools, I'll manage with what I have in my hands, I do this in traditional art all the time. Its performance and stability that matters and these are greatly improved. Thanks again Andrew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philnolan3d Posted November 7, 2010 Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 The renderer (r-room) stops at 210 samples. Minor issue of course. I'm impressed with this new beta. I saved it LOL. I was working all night, I tried as much I could. Even UVs and baking performance is much faster and seems stable. (the Mac build). I personally don't complain about behavior of tools, I'll manage with what I have in my hands, I do this in traditional art all the time. Its performance and stability that matters and these are greatly improved. Thanks again Andrew. Curious, I tested this and didn't see that problem, but did see something related. Non 32bit rendering is supposed to stop at 320 samples. Whether I have the 32 bit box checked or not checked it still renders forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Digital777 Posted November 7, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 I am not sure if you looked into the bugs from the other day but i have had some of them again and took screenshots - Voxel mode with paint mode icons - Broken results in surface mode like Artman had which seems un-fixable with smooth etc once it happens until you go back to voxel mode - I will be posting various new ideas and a few bugs in my forum threads later today also. I don't think those are to do with the beta though which is why i won't post those here. Edit - The new ideas/suggestions and bugs are now posted - http://www.3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=6722&view=findpost&p=52652 http://www.3d-coat.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=6259&view=findpost&p=52651 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member fingers Posted November 7, 2010 Member Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 Hi all, I'm having a little different problem with version 3.5.04B. In the paint room, I can't get the airbrush tool to paint color if specularity is turned off. If spec is turned on it works fine...but I have to lower the spec to zero to paint color... but it must remain turned on. Depth seems OK... I have deleted my "options" before my last install I'm just wondering, maybe this is spoze to be this way now ? Or is it just me i7/950 quad 8g ram nVidia 1g GTS250 Win7-64bit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Shpagin Posted November 7, 2010 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 Linux build 3.5.04B uploaded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Mykyl Posted November 7, 2010 Advanced Member Report Share Posted November 7, 2010 Are you using one of the new Derpth Shaders? Like This vs. This? Not that I am aware of. Its not quite faceting more little black shadows that show up on shaders that used to be smooth. Cheers Mike R Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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