Member Flippers Posted October 16, 2014 Member Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 been using the demo for over a month. i absolutely love 3d coat but its ridiculously unstable. i get the most random crashes on pc or mac. for no reason parts of my model will dissapear or it will get distorted all the sudden? ...i'm using the latest beta btw and ive seen no improvement on stability. we're in pre production at work and i have been telling my art director all about the wonders of 3d coat. we cant use this tool as is though, its super buggy. anyone else having issues? damnit! i want to use coat but i cant. i keep losing work. wtf! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Malo Posted October 16, 2014 Contributor Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 No issues. If i rember correctly, only one ctd in the last two months. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member jburford Posted October 16, 2014 Member Report Share Posted October 16, 2014 There must be something very strange with your setup or such as I have almost never ever had any such problems over the past 4 years regardless of version. Odd Graphic Drivers? Norton Anti-Virus? Low memory..... what is your setup? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carlosan Posted October 17, 2014 Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 which version and system specs do you have ? do you have an ATI card ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor AbnRanger Posted October 17, 2014 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 Agreed with the rest. There is something funky on your end. I'm not having crashes or stability problems either. Not with 4.1.17. Delete the Options.xml file....in fact, you might be better off just deleting all the individual files in the MyDocs/3D Coat V4 directory, except for the License.dat file (you need that). And obviously don't delete the folders. Now, do a fresh install of 4.1.17 + update your graphic card drivers + don't use the CUDA version if you are using an AMD graphics card. I would also highly suggest using the DX version rather than the GL version. DX has always worked better in 3D Coat than the OpenGL version. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor AbnRanger Posted October 17, 2014 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 You might also be working on a scene that strangely got buggered up somehow. Maybe try and test on some default objects (Mannequin, Human Primitive, etc), from the splash screen. If you are having no troubles with them, then the problem is isolated to a particular scene. In that case, you can upload the file to the 3D Coat server from the HELP menu > contact Andrew (support@3d-coat.com) and let him know you just uploaded the problem file...and repeat what you just mentioned here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor ajz3d Posted October 17, 2014 Contributor Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 Agreed with the rest. There is something funky on your end. I'm not having crashes or stability problems either. Not with 4.1.17. Delete the Options.xml file....in fact, you might be better off just deleting all the individual files in the MyDocs/3D Coat V4 directory, except for the License.dat file (you need that). And obviously don't delete the folders. I had some problems a few days ago with 3D Coat crashing on almost each Unwrap or Export Model operation (in UV Room). Eventually it displayed some information about options.xml being corrupted. It deleted this file and replaced it with a default one. I imported my backed up settings and since then I had no problems. So it might be worth to try with a clean options.xml, like AbnRanger suggested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member 3DTutorial Posted October 17, 2014 Member Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 I use 3D Coat daily, It's always rock solid. Very rarely do I experience a crash. I suspect the issue is with your hardware configuration. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Solution Flippers Posted October 17, 2014 Author Member Solution Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 well, you guys rule! i got really excellent advice on a fix for this. i have been using open gl version. so ill switch that and follow abnRanger's advice. thanks again guys. i really love 3d coat btw. thats why it kills me i was scared i wouldn't be able to use it. its absolutely stunning what it does compared to zbrush. cheers! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Javis Posted October 17, 2014 Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 Ah yes, the OGL for windows version is not so great. DX version on the other hand... Solid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Aleksey Posted October 17, 2014 Advanced Member Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 well, you guys rule! i got really excellent advice on a fix for this. i have been using open gl version. so ill switch that and follow abnRanger's advice. thanks again guys. i really love 3d coat btw. thats why it kills me i was scared i wouldn't be able to use it. its absolutely stunning what it does compared to zbrush. cheers! love hearing this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Rkhane Posted October 17, 2014 Member Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 Hmmm, wierd, my 3d coat seems reasonably stable but by far the fastest version for me is Cuda GL 64, really nicfe actually. All the other versions really drag when displaying the models no matter what room it is in. Using Nvidia 750ti and old COre 2 Duo... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor ajz3d Posted October 17, 2014 Contributor Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 Off-topic. I wonder if having a non-ECC memory modules might be a culprit of at least some of the crashes in memory intensive programs. I remember reading an article which said that the more memory you have, the bigger chances are that one of the neutrinos hitting your modules will cause a bit swap (1 to 0 or the other way around). This might or might not cause a corruption of some data or be the reason of a program crash, depending on what this particular bit was used for. I went trough the roof after reading this article, because I did it just a few days after I have purchased the 3930K CPU, which doesn't support ECC modules at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor TimmyZDesign Posted October 17, 2014 Contributor Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 Off-topic. I wonder if having a non-ECC memory modules might be a culprit of at least some of the crashes in memory intensive programs. I remember reading an article which said that the more memory you have, the bigger chances are that one of the neutrinos hitting your modules will cause a bit swap (1 to 0 or the other way around). This might or might not cause a corruption of some data or be the reason of a program crash, depending on what this particular bit was used for. I went trough the roof after reading this article, because I did it just a few days after I have purchased the 3930K CPU, which doesn't support ECC modules at all. But I read a long time ago that ECC memory is slower than non-ECC because it checks for errors. Is the extra speed worth taking the risk? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor Tony Nemo Posted October 17, 2014 Contributor Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 I have ECC memory and I still get crashes and it's very expensive. Nice to know it checks for errors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contributor ajz3d Posted October 17, 2014 Contributor Report Share Posted October 17, 2014 (edited) But I read a long time ago that ECC memory is slower than non-ECC because it checks for errors. Is the extra speed worth taking the risk? It's roughly about 2% slower. That is if we can trust this article amongst others: Finally, ECC RAM is slightly slower than non-ECC RAM. Many memory manufacturers say that ECC RAM will be roughly 2% slower than standard RAM due to the additional time it takes for the system to check for any memory errors. To verify this, we examined multiple benchmarks that we run on each system we produce. By using comparable CPUs (For example: Intel Core i7 4771 3.5GHz Quad Core 8MB versus Intel Xeon E3-1275 V3 3.5GHZ Quad Core 8MB) we found that this 2% estimate to be roughly correct. Our own benchmarks showed a performance hit ranging from .72 to 2.2% which, given normal testing deviations, is right in line with the 2% estimate. Source: http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Advantages-of-ECC-Memory-520/ I also found some forum posts that claim ECC modules are more than 20% slower that non-ECC, but I don't believe in such a huge difference. I think all of the Apple computers use ECC memory (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong of course). Might it be one of their keys to system stability? Tony, I'm sorry to hear this. But maybe your crashes are of different, non-memory related origin? ECC modules are used in servers for a reason, to add more system stability and to prevent data corruption (for example, try to run NAS on a system that uses a ZFS zpool, but also runs on non-ECC modules, and eventually data corruption will happen). Maybe with non-ECC memory you would have slightly more of them crashes? But it all depends on how much memory you have and with how memory-hungry scenes you work with. Anyway, it was just a thought. Nothing to do with this topic. Edited October 17, 2014 by ajz3d Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor AbnRanger Posted October 18, 2014 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 Hmmm, wierd, my 3d coat seems reasonably stable but by far the fastest version for me is Cuda GL 64, really nicfe actually. All the other versions really drag when displaying the models no matter what room it is in. Using Nvidia 750ti and old COre 2 Duo... I'm using a GTX 580 3GB, and it works flawlessly in Windows CUDA DX 64. Every time I tried using the GL version, it was noticeably slower navigating about the scene. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member douglasrthomson Posted October 18, 2014 Member Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 (edited) ....in fact, you might be better off just deleting all the individual files in the MyDocs/3D Coat V4 directory, except for the License.dat file (you need that). And obviously don't delete the folders. Is there a sort of "best practice' for installing/updating 3d Coat? I've had quite a few problems with 3dCoat crashing on my Macs (I have it installed on a desktop and a laptop). I'm running OSX Mavericks on both Machines and am due to update from 4.1.04A to 4.1.17. The crashing seems to be getting worse with every 'update'. Should I be doing a 'clean' install every time there is an upgrade? Edited October 18, 2014 by douglasrthomson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor AbnRanger Posted October 18, 2014 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 Is there a sort of "best practice' for installing/updating 3d Coat? I've had quite a few problems with 3dCoat crashing on my Macs (I have it installed on a desktop and a laptop). I'm running OSX Mavericks on both Machines and am due to update from 4.1.04A to 4.1.17. The crashing seems to be getting worse with every 'update'. Should I be doing a 'clean' install every time there is an upgrade? No need for a clean install each time. You might e-mail Andrew (support@3D-coat.com), and ask him to have Sergi (the staffer who ports the builds to MAC/Linux) contact you, to see what the root of the problem is. Is it crashing on one specific project/scenefile, or does it occur if you test it on a standard object from the Splash Screen menu? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member douglasrthomson Posted October 18, 2014 Member Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 Ok, thanks. I'll note the actions that cause the problems and let Andrew know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Rkhane Posted October 18, 2014 Member Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 I'm using a GTX 580 3GB, and it works flawlessly in Windows CUDA DX 64. Every time I tried using the GL version, it was noticeably slower navigating about the scene. That's bizzare, I have the opposite experience. I'm on Win 7 pro 64 bit, Service Pack 1, Direct X 11 installed, 2.66 Core 2 duo, 8 gigs system ram, GTX 750ti 2gb (Was using a EVGA GTX 460/768meg version but it died, humorouosly speaking the 750ti is about 3x faster for displaying renders especially with large poly counts 20mil+ despite the 750ti having a lower memory bus, 128 VS 192bit, I think the higher ram amount made the difference). As you said but with Direct X, easily noticeably slower when moving the camera around while working, it just drags in DX but is substantially faster in OGL. Just checked it again with a 28mil triangle model, the GL version displays way smoother and flies when moving the camera around. The DX version displays okay but the camera has very noticable lag and stutters when moving around. I would say the GL version is twice as smooth/fast for me. I can't figure that out but eh, It's great to have the options! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Aleksey Posted October 18, 2014 Advanced Member Report Share Posted October 18, 2014 Ye for me the DX version works noticable better, im on a 560ti. Just got a new system with 970 in it. dont have coat installed there though, will try it and give updates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Javis Posted October 27, 2014 Report Share Posted October 27, 2014 No need for a clean install each time. You might e-mail Andrew (support@3D-coat.com), and ask him to have Sergi (the staffer who ports the builds to MAC/Linux) contact you, to see what the root of the problem is. Is it crashing on one specific project/scenefile, or does it occur if you test it on a standard object from the Splash Screen menu? This is not accurate. Having multiple installs is a known issue for many common problems that arise. This is because each build shares config files. If you are having any issues and you have multiple installations, the first thing I recommend is closing 3DC, trashing your config files (back them up first), then trying 3DC again to see if the issue is still happening. If not then you can almost safely say that multiple installations was indeed the problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reputable Contributor AbnRanger Posted October 30, 2014 Reputable Contributor Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 This is not accurate. Having multiple installs is a known issue for many common problems that arise. This is because each build shares config files. If you are having any issues and you have multiple installations, the first thing I recommend is closing 3DC, trashing your config files (back them up first), then trying 3DC again to see if the issue is still happening. If not then you can almost safely say that multiple installations was indeed the problem. Andrew said, himself, that it is not necessary to un-install first, each time one installs a new build. Wiping out config files each time = having to reload Hotkey layouts, Workspace layouts, Navigation options, Color Scheme, etc, etc. It's a royal pain in the bum to have to do this each time. One in a while, maybe. but not with each new build. That's coming from Andrew, directly...as well as 6+yrs of experience in the app. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advanced Member Aleksey Posted October 30, 2014 Advanced Member Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 is it possible to get every install to make a new config folder? or be able to even set the config folder manually? maybe separate the hotkey files out so you dont have to re-apply them. I know in cinema4d. if you copy the program folder and launch c4d, it automatically makes a new config folder in you documents folder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Javis Posted October 30, 2014 Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 Andrew said, himself, that it is not necessary to un-install first, each time one installs a new build. Wiping out config files each time = having to reload Hotkey layouts, Workspace layouts, Navigation options, Color Scheme, etc, etc. It's a royal pain in the bum to have to do this each time. One in a while, maybe. but not with each new build. That's coming from Andrew, directly...as well as 6+yrs of experience in the app. Great, good for you. Unfortunately that's just not true. All my experiences say otherwise, and you should know this too from all of your troubles with 3DC that you have experienced. What's usually the fix? Delete your config files. If you back up your preferences, deleting the broken configs and copying your saved ones into the right folder is no trouble at all. The key = backup your stuff. In fact corrupt config files is common with lots of different applications that's it's almost always the first suggestion (Lw, Modo, etc). Should it happen? A little less often would be nice, but that's how computers work, and solution easy. If saving, deleting and copying a few files on a computer is so hard, you're in the wrong line of work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Javis Posted October 30, 2014 Report Share Posted October 30, 2014 is it possible to get every install to make a new config folder? or be able to even set the config folder manually? maybe separate the hotkey files out so you dont have to re-apply them. I know in cinema4d. if you copy the program folder and launch c4d, it automatically makes a new config folder in you documents folder. I've tried a few things, like starting a shortcut with a command attached to it and also terminal starting. With no luck. I think the directory is hard coded. Sounds like a feature request is in order! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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