V4.1 BETA (experimental 4.1.17D)

[AbnRanger]

This is embarrassing.

Thanks for the tip, Ranger. I better close the Mantis report.

No problem. You're right, that It is a little bit odd not having a "duplicate layer" icon like you have in the voxel room and paint room. This is pretty close, though.

[geo_n]

Click "Select all faces on layer" icon at the bottom of the panel (or just the faces you want to duplicate) > CLONE button. 2-3 clicks (a new layer is created for you)

Took me some thinking to figure that one out before when I needed. I think these kinds of operations should be done in a standard way. Select all faces on layer, ctr c then ctr v. Just make stuff like this work with standard copy paste.

[Andrew Shpagin]

Updated to BETA10 (Win)

- Magic wand tool in Paint room

- New items in VoxTree->RMB menu: Show all, Shoaw subtree (to make nodes visible)

- All applicable brush jitters will act on merge tool in "On pen" mode - http://t.co/JynOj0D2

- VoxExtruude works now correctly with different combinations of symmetry/extrude directions/flattern

- a lot of mantis reported problems fixed, big work done there

[wave of light]

"Show all, Shoaw subtree (to make nodes visible)"

That will be a massive time saver.

looking forward to taking her for a spin.

[Carlosan]

finally BETA10 YES !!!! ty !!!!!

Paint

magic wands works fine great add !!,

users must take care about symmetry: doesn't have effect

you need to select both sides L&R

[ajz3d]

Jolly good show there, Andrew!

[ajz3d]

There's always approximately 2-3 seconds of delay when switching tools in Retopo Room. Switching tools in Voxel Room or Paint Room doesn't have this lag.

[AbnRanger]

There's always approximately 2-3 seconds of delay when switching tools in Retopo Room. Switching tools in Voxel Room or Paint Room doesn't have this lag.

+1. It gets really annoying after a while, too.

[Eric Cosky]

Speaking of delay & lag, one of my biggest long-term complaints about 3DC is how often the app is unresponsive with little or no indication of what is going on or how long it might take to finish whatever operation I just triggered. This spans pretty much the entire app when any expensive operation is performed, I presume because the basic app framework has the UI processing done by the same thread doing all the heavy lifting. While some of these operations do have (pretty easy to not notice) indicators in the status bar, most commands don't. In terms of the quality of user experience, I think it is a pretty big deal to have the app window visibly grayed out by the OS because it isn't handling input events in a timely manner. Every single time I wonder, did it crash again? Should I wait longer? Will I be going to the task manager to kill it? It would be really nice to see this improved someday, but I do recognize that this would probably be a lot of work and may never happen.

[philnolan3d]

Yes, 3DC has always done this as long as I've used it. Whenever it's busy "thinking" the title bar says "Not responding" so it appears as if it has crashed. I've learned to ignore this and it usually just finishes what it's doing but new people may not know to do that.

[Schnupps]

The new Spline E-mode is nice, but Edit Pressure profile doesn´t seem to change anything?

And what does the help text "Please define the flow of pen pressure along the each chunk of the stroke" mean. "the each chunk" is confusing me, English is not my mother´s tongue btw

[Tony Nemo]

It probably means each leg between pen clicks which would easily vary without the addition of a "pen pressure" number, as for instance, hard at the click and going soft in the interval before the next click.

[AbnRanger]

The new Spline E-mode is nice, but Edit Pressure profile doesn´t seem to change anything?

And what does the help text "Please define the flow of pen pressure along the each chunk of the stroke" mean. "the each chunk" is confusing me, English is not my mother´s tongue btw

Carcass....chunk...autopo, two different Materials panels. It's got to be confusing to a new user, for sure. Autopo is one "o" from being pronounced Auto-poo. Can we fix that, Andrew (back to what it was originally called, and what makes most sense...Auto-Retopo)?

[ajz3d]

Okay, this one is weird. I've merged with NM (per-pixel) with some subdivision applied in the "Import object for per pixel painting" window and 3D Coat generated some unwanted edges in my topology. Take a look at the two wireframes below. Both screenshots come from the Paint Room (and are flat shaded). On the left side is the low-poly mesh with correct edge flow. On the right side, subdivided - with three additional edge loops that were generated by 3D Coat.

What's going on here?

(Beta10)

[AbnRanger]

Okay, this one is weird. I've merged with NM (per-pixel) with some subdivision applied in the "Import object for per pixel painting" window and 3D Coat generated some unwanted edges in my topology. Take a look at the two wireframes below. Both screenshots come from the Paint Room (and are flat shaded). On the left side is the low-poly mesh with correct edge flow. On the right side, subdivided - with three additional edge loops that were generated by 3D Coat.

What's going on here?

(Beta10)

Sometimes...and this happens often in 3ds Max, too....you may have some overlapping vertices. You can go to the Retopo Menu and check. "Select Faces" > Tri's (they will be selected and highlighted) > Ngons (same thing). If you have an extra vertex hanging around, uninvited, that should point it out. You can also use the Move Vertices tool and hover your cursor around the affected area and see if one isn't spotted. Another way to examine it is to choose the SELECT tool > Lasso select the whole mesh in Vertices mode. You should be able to see if there is one or more hanging around along an edge all by itself. In this case, I think it's more than one vert occupying the same spot.

[ajz3d]

Oh, sorry for raising false alarm again. You're right - four n-gons were to blame. Somehow I missed them. Still, I'm not sure how were they created in the first place, because I was using Quads tool in this area and it snapped to neighbouring vertices every time.

[geo_n]

Is this beta CUDA or non CUDA? I'm installing on a pc with no nvidia card.

[Zeddicus]

Is this beta CUDA or non CUDA? I'm installing on a pc with no nvidia card.

Both are included (GL and DX both with and without CUDA). The choice of download has been reduced to whether you want the 32-bit or 64-bit version of 3DC.

[Andrew Shpagin]

The new Spline E-mode is nice, but Edit Pressure profile doesn´t seem to change anything?

And what does the help text "Please define the flow of pen pressure along the each chunk of the stroke" mean. "the each chunk" is confusing me, English is not my mother´s tongue btw

Curve may have several chunks. Draw one chonk. Press ESC. Start next one. Each chunk's pressure will be modulated. But you will not see pressure until you turn on depth on pressure dependence ot radius on pressure dependence.

[philnolan3d]

I'm guessing by chunk you mean the sections between the nodes?

[Javis]

Updated to BETA10 (Win)

- Magic wand tool in Paint room

- New items in VoxTree->RMB menu: Show all, Shoaw subtree (to make nodes visible)

- All applicable brush jitters will act on merge tool in "On pen" mode - http://t.co/JynOj0D2

- VoxExtruude works now correctly with different combinations of symmetry/extrude directions/flattern

- a lot of mantis reported problems fixed, big work done there

Andrew, thanks for taking the time to fix so many bugs from mantis. I know it's not the funnest thing to do in the world, bug having 3DC as stable as it is right now is the best thing since v3 released with voxels. So thank you.

Carcass....chunk...autopo, two different Materials panels. It's got to be confusing to a new user, for sure. Autopo is one "o" from being pronounced Auto-poo. Can we fix that, Andrew (back to what it was originally called, and what makes most sense...Auto-Retopo)?

Been trying to get those naming conventions fixed for a long time. However, autopo is a chosen name that some of us liked. Not everyone likes it, but it sure doesn't flow off the tongue a lot easier than automatic retopology or quadrangulation, or automatic retopologization, etc.. As you know, if you don't like some name or wording in 3DC, you can easily change all of the entries in the XML file from "Autopo" to "Dons newly renamed auto retopology long named tool goes here kthxbi".

Cheers.

[AbnRanger]

Andrew, thanks for taking the time to fix so many bugs from mantis. I know it's not the funnest thing to do in the world, bug having 3DC as stable as it is right now is the best thing since v3 released with voxels. So thank you.

Been trying to get those naming conventions fixed for a long time. However, autopo is a chosen name that some of us liked. Not everyone likes it, but it sure doesn't flow off the tongue a lot easier than automatic retopology or quadrangulation, or automatic retopologization, etc.. As you know, if you don't like some name or wording in 3DC, you can easily change all of the entries in the XML file from "Autopo" to "Dons newly renamed auto retopology long named tool goes here kthxbi".

Cheers.

Again...it made/makes more sense to EVERYONE just as it was. When people walked by the poster at Siggraph, they had a good idea what it was. If it was titled Autopo, everyone would have asked "What the heck is that supposed to be?" Auto-Retopo is plenty short enough for a button of it's own. However, seeing that it is hidden in a right-click menu, length of the name shouldn't be an issue at all.

[Javis]

Man those two dudes are looking sharp! Good stuff. That was an interesting event. Hey Andrew, any chance we're going to SIGGRAPH this year again? I have another person that can demonstrate 3DC for 3D printing, too.

Anyway,

Short in menus? Check.

Easy to say? Check.

Can rename it if you don't like it? Check.

Is described as an automatic retopology tool, but in the UI and manual has a well thought out descriptive name Check.

Autopo it is! Moving on to more pressing matters.

[Zeddicus]

Retauto?

Thanks for all those bug fixes, Andrew. As a developer you are a joy to deal with. You listen to your customers with an open mind and are very quick to act on bug reports. Hopefully 3DC will some day get the recognition and crazy rabid fandom it deserves like ZBrush tends to attract.

[Carlosan]

Standardization is the Key to sucess

new users need to edit the xml to have naming conventions right ?

cmon

if its so easy to do it... well... naming conventions must be in the standard install file.

and

discussions about to change Autopo to AutoREtopo. Discussions about to add 2 letters ?

relax people... keep your time finding bugs... respect the naming conventions.

[Zeddicus]

discussions about to change Autopo to AutoREtopo. Discussions about to add 2 letters ?

It involves adding four letters actually, but I kind of like Autotopo now that you pointed it out.

[David Schoneveld]

I started modeling or uprezing a character by bringing in from Maya a lower rez mesh. I added and sculpted a lot since then. I was using 3.X and continued though 4 beta10. When I export the model its about 200x bigger and offset position from the original. Is that a bug or is there a way to correct that?

[AbnRanger]

Man those two dudes are looking sharp! Good stuff. That was an interesting event. Hey Andrew, any chance we're going to SIGGRAPH this year again? I have another person that can demonstrate 3DC for 3D printing, too.

Anyway,

Short in menus? Check.

Easy to say? Check.

Can rename it if you don't like it? Check.

Is described as an automatic retopology tool, but in the UI and manual has a well thought out descriptive name Check.

Autopo it is! Moving on to more pressing matters.

The point is again, Javis, not a matter of personal preference, but making it as easy as possible for NEW USERS to understand the tools and terminology. Just because you and Greg happen to like it, doesn't make it a good fit. If it's hard to pronounce and for a new user (to 3D Coat...most are not new to 3D in general) to gather it's purpose, then that's more than enough reason to leave it as it was (Auto-Retopo).

By the way, it seems you can't change it entirely in the XML file. I tried looking up and changing every reference to it in the file and it is still there in the main right-click menu (the sub-menus change, but not the main one).

[BeatKitano]

I stand with AbnRanger, even if it means that sometimes (if it's applied) I will be forced to relearn some parts of the program, but if those are the good choice it shouldn't be too hard

I personally would hate 3dcoat having commercial difficulties because some old users (myself included) wanted to keep their old habits while new comers are completely lost and decide that the money is better injected somewhere else. Everything should be focused on accessibility/ease of use imho.

Now: I don't care if it's autopo or autoretopo (even though it's much clearer from a technical standpoint)... I agree with the concept here: DEFAULT settings > MOST ACCESSIBLE settings.

BTW I guess Autopo was decided because it was a "proprietary" point, something to sell as a new unique feature (but from a marketing point it's not nicely played because you'll always have to explain it's "auto-retopology"), and most user which are not "experts" in the use of the software simply refer to it as auto retopo.

@AbnRanger: some entries are hardcoded, Andrew forgot to add references to external files during some "speed coded" feature

[AbnRanger]

I stand with AbnRanger, even if it means that sometimes (if it's applied) I will be forced to relearn some parts of the program, but if those are the good choice it shouldn't be too hard

I personally would hate 3dcoat having commercial difficulties because some old users (myself included) wanted to keep their old habits while new comers are completely lost and decide that the money is better injected somewhere else. Everything should be focused on accessibility/ease of use imho.

Now: I don't care if it's autopo or autoretopo (even though it's much clearer from a technical standpoint)... I agree with the concept here: DEFAULT settings > MOST ACCESSIBLE settings.

BTW I guess Autopo was decided because it was a "proprietary" point, something to sell as a new unique feature (but from a marketing point it's not nicely played because you'll always have to explain it's "auto-retopology"), and most user which are not "experts" in the use of the software simply refer to it as auto retopo.

@AbnRanger: some entries are hardcoded, Andrew forgot to add references to external files during some "speed coded" feature

You hit the nail on the head. The usage of INTERPOLATE instead of something simple like STEADY STROKE, or CARCASS mesh instead of VIEWPORT mesh is another example of this. How is it that we still have 2 different MATERIAL Panels in the same workspace? It's embarrassing to be demonstrating the power of the Painting toolset and yet have these two panels in the UI sharing the same name. It's like going to a job interview all dressed up, but having a sleeve missing from your shirt.

All the effort spent on the UI and we still have this simple problem, that can be easily fixed? And the reason it's being brought up again is because we're on the verge of a major release. Surely we want to tie up all the loose ends beforehand...?