V4.5 BETA (experimental)

[ajz3d]

Stu, you just need to apply one of the ordinary shaders to your sculpt. PBR shader will always use the envmap.

[Javis]

Hey there folks,

 

Glad to see 3DCoat adapting PBR. While playing around with it today I noticed a few issues. I am using the same EXR in Unity 5 (Beta 17) and also in Substance Painter and now in 3DCoat to make sure I am using the same lighting conditions to compare. While it all looks good in Unity and Substance Painter, it doesn't in 3DCoat. The lighting has an odd green touch to it and seems generally darker. Normal maps also seem very flat currently (see image). No matter what settings I have in the shader (normal map cranked up) it always looks rather flat and uninspiring compared to Substance Painter/Designer/Unity. 

 

What are the plans currently on exposing more light/rendering features in viewport? Is what I am looking at in the viewport rendered in Linear color space? Also, are there any plans for further post effects like Tone Mapping, etc? 

 

Hi Thomas!

 

 

I see what you are meaning now. Twitter is so limiting with text. Sorry! Anyway, so the problem is more obvious. When you're applying your materials, it looks like the color for them is set to "modulate" (multiplies the color of the foreground color you have selected). If you don't want that to happen make sure to go into the Material Editor and turn modulate to "Replace". It's the icon next to the color layer that looks like an asterisk, replace is a turning arrow.

 

Hopefully Andrew can answer your question about the extra lighting options. I hope for more options in the lighting department as well.

[Thomas P.]

Hey there Javis,

 

Thanks for the reply! Chaning the "Modulate" to "Replace" surely did the trick color wise. Why is Modulate the standard? Should perhaps be the other way around then? 

 

The normal map still shows very flat however as you can see in my example shot below...

 

Here are two videos that show the difference a bit more drastic (Painter vs 3DCoat)

 

Painter:  https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/449179/Bugreports/DoorPainter.mp4

 

3DCoat: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/449179/Bugreports/Door3DCoat.mp4

Edited December 21, 2014 by Thomas P.

[Tony Nemo]

Transform widget disappears:

[ajz3d]

What happened to specularity (glossiness) blending modes? I can't find them.

[vjanomolee]

When can we expect the Mac version of 4.5?  I use both PC and Mac personally, but when I teach 3D-Coat in my high school classroom its all iMac's.  I was hoping to get 4.5 installed on all the machines in my lab before we return from winter break.  *fingers crossed

[Javis]

Hey there Javis,

 

Thanks for the reply! Chaning the "Modulate" to "Replace" surely did the trick color wise. Why is Modulate the standard? Should perhaps be the other way around then? 

 

The normal map still shows very flat however as you can see in my example shot below...

 

 

I agree, replace should probably be the default.

 

 

If you don't mind PMing me your 3B file, I'll be happy to take a look at what's up with the normal map later this evening. Let me know!

[Thomas P.]

I agree, replace should probably be the default.

 

 

If you don't mind PMing me your 3B file, I'll be happy to take a look at what's up with the normal map later this evening. Let me know!

 

I shall send you the scene. Thanks for helping/checking. On that note, I don't know how 3DCoat compresses textures if at all in viewport. Maybe that is related.

[ajz3d]

There are some weird things happening when using Sampler Tool and Pick Color/Depth/Glossiness (v-key). Try this (using both tools) when vertex painting a sphere (apply a PBR material in the Sculpt Room first):

1. Choose pure red colour, 100% glossiness and 100% metalness.

1.1. Paint a small area.

1.2. Use Sampler Tool over it and then paint another area. Note the differences.

1.3. Use the Pick Color/Depth/Glossiness on initially painted area and lay down a brush stroke. Again, note the differences.

 

2. Choose pure red colour, 100% glossiness and 0% metalness.

2.1. Paint a small area.

2.2. Use Sampler Tool over it and then paint another area. Note the differences.

2.3. Do the same with Pick Color/Depth/Glossiness.

 

3. Repeat step 2.

3.1. Use Sampler Tool over area from point 1.1.

3.2. Paint some area and note the differences.

3.3. Repeat step 2.

3.4. Use Pick Color/Depth/Glossiness over are from point 1.1.

[AbnRanger]

I shall send you the scene. Thanks for helping/checking. On that note, I don't know how 3DCoat compresses textures if at all in viewport. Maybe that is related.

I know sometimes when I import an obj directly into the Paint room, that for some odd reason, the normal map doesn't come along for the ride. Maybe that is what's happening for you? I end up having to import the NMap in separately. TEXTURES > IMPORT > Normal Map

[freakmean16]

I dont know if this is already solved...but everytime I select the PBR materials in the popup window it just sends me to the old material window!!!Am I doing something wrong here???

[Andrew Shpagin]

When can we expect the Mac version of 4.5?  I use both PC and Mac personally, but when I teach 3D-Coat in my high school classroom its all iMac's.  I was hoping to get 4.5 installed on all the machines in my lab before we return from winter break.  *fingers crossed

Mac/Linux versions are expected after making GL shaders. Now all shaders are DX, so only DX version works. This is main obstacle to make Mac/inux version.

[stusutcliffe]

Stu, you just need to apply one of the ordinary shaders to your sculpt. PBR shader will always use the envmap.

I was looking at a previously painted model I had made without pbr, in the paint room/ window and it was being lit by the image ,I thought I would be able to switch it off. 

Anyway ,I have gone back to 17d for now ,because exporting crashes all the time.

 

Gonna have to paint my "boob armour" a different way for now......

[Malo]

The most crashes during export is, if you want to overwrite files.

Delete all older files and you dont get an crash on export.

[stusutcliffe]

Thanks, but I have been making a brand new folder for my tests, so no overwriting.

I did manage to get something exported but I cannot figure out how to apply my textures in Carrara to make it look like the model in 3dcoat. I think this pbr thing is designed to work for game engine type stuff....which I know nothing about.

Maybe Carrara is to old now . How would one export a pbr painted model to Maya or Max? Is it possible . If someone can do that maybe I can extrapolate that method for Carrara.

[Malo]

Yes the textures are for Games or Render Engines that support PBR like Marmorset.

To use it in different Render Engines you have to setup your Material, Shaders and Textures correctly.

Sad, that my hint solved your problem. On my side it works as usual if i dont overwrite files.

 

Anyway.

First, could anybody confirm if the Bake with Name Correspondence is no longer working, please?

I dont get any results if i use that option.

 

Second, i am no longer able to edit Values like the Dedail of LC or in the Brush Options.

I only could work with Mouse&Drag but not able to enter a value.

 

Could anybody confirm that bugs.

Edited December 22, 2014 by Malo

[geo_n]

Thanks, but I have been making a brand new folder for my tests, so no overwriting.

I did manage to get something exported but I cannot figure out how to apply my textures in Carrara to make it look like the model in 3dcoat. I think this pbr thing is designed to work for game engine type stuff....which I know nothing about.

Maybe Carrara is to old now . How would one export a pbr painted model to Maya or Max? Is it possible . If someone can do that maybe I can extrapolate that method for Carrara.

 

Does carrara have nodes and shaders that support pbr? The traditional diffuse, spec, gloss materials in most 3d appz are not compatible with pbr. But most node based appz(3dmax, maya, lightwave) can replicate pbr when the scene is set up for it.

[ajz3d]

(...)

First, could anybody confirm if the Bake with Name Correspondence is no longer working, please?

I dont get any results if i use that option.

(...)

Could anybody confirm that bugs.

Yea, I just checked and it's broken.

 

Reported: http://3d-coat.com/mantis/view.php?id=1694

Edited December 22, 2014 by ajz3d

[Carlosan]

This option help in Carrara workflow ?

[stusutcliffe]

I guess it does not support pbr. I wanted to export a nice worn paint on metal I did that looked really good. I can do it in carrara ,it involves shader mixers and masks . But it is a bit complicated and I always forget how to do it. 

Carlosan... I tried those options , but the key thing is ,I dont know what to do with the resulting maps in Carrara. Plus that top option was one of the crashes I had. But the Gloss /Metalness exported ONCE, but I had no luck in Carrara.

I think the main problem is I aint smart enough!! Thanks for chipping in everybody.

[Carlosan]

Octane render plugin help to get PBR support inside Carrara.

 

Luxus for Carrara let to get photo realistic render, but i duno if Luxrender had PBR support.

 

 

* Marmoset Toolbag is less expensive

[stusutcliffe]

Thanks Carlosen, Octane is too expensive, I have Luxus  but not really used it because it doesnt render Carrara hair.( which I use more or less for everything!) I think Marmoset does not render hair unless its an obj. ( Carrara hair is its own unique system) I have my own little workflow that I dont want to change too much, especially if I am forking out cash for every little change.....But If it wont export for me, Im up S**t creek without a paddle anyway!

I think my file was massive anyway, I had to split the scene just so my memory did not run out.

 

I think I will give 4.5 another go and maybe just try and export the scene in small chunks. And if I can export the individual layers of paint I may be able to do some mask/mixer shannanigans!

[Rebelismo]

Hey Guys!

 

I've been playing with this new build since it was released (it's awesome). I was just wondering...Are there any linear workflow settings for the viewport? I know that we can adjust the gamma on the textures, but I wanted to create a 1:1 comparison with the render engine that I'm using. 

 

Thanks in advance!

[Javis]

Hi!

 

Unfortunately not at the moment, but I'm hoping it's in the next build. It's the next logical step to be implemented now that we have PBR shading. It's a necessary component for accurate textures.

[alvordr]

I've never understood the point of having modulate as the default in the paint room.  100% of the time I'm changing this to something else.

[Rebelismo]

Hi!

 

Unfortunately not at the moment, but I'm hoping it's in the next build. It's the next logical step to be implemented now that we have PBR shading. It's a necessary component for accurate textures.

Thanks for the response Javis! This new build is quite awesome either way. Also, great job on the PBR video, and hope you make more

[jcue]

hello,

 

Since 3D Coat will now incorporate PBR is there any benefit to buying/keeping Marmoset Toolbag? In one of Andrew's tweets he noted that 3d coat pbr will be fully compatible with Marmoset so I'm just curious if there is a benefit to having both. 

[artman]

hello,

 

Since 3D Coat will now incorporate PBR is there any benefit to buying/keeping Marmoset Toolbag? In one of Andrew's tweets he noted that 3d coat pbr will be fully compatible with Marmoset so I'm just curious if there is a benefit to having both. 

Marmoset is a renderer and has much more features to display nicely your work made in 3DC than 3Dc itself (ex:skin shader,post-processes ect...)

So there is great benefit to having both.

[jcue]

Marmoset is a renderer and has much more features to display nicely your work made in 3DC than 3Dc itself (ex:skin shader,post-processes ect...)

So there is great benefit to having both.

That makes sense. Thanks for the response

[BeatKitano]

I'm probably stupid but I gotta ask: how do you get the pbr rendering without the pbr material preview window ?

Can't get it to work without it and it's kinda defeating the whole purpose.

 

 

I've got another issue: no cubemaps as reflections. I mean mirror and golden and that kind of material is just plain color... no cubemaping showing.

 

Yellow part is supposed to be gold (highly reflective)