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3DCoat 2022 development thread


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On 1/19/2022 at 4:11 PM, Daffyd said:


Hello, new problem with "Take subdivided Paint Mesh into the sculpt room" feature.

Normal maps and displacement maps are ignored and are not baked into the highpoly as details. I only get the color map. Isn't that part of the feature yet?

Steps:

1. Imported Mesh into Paint Room
2. imported Albedo + Normal Map
3. In sculpt room "Take subdivided Paint Mesh into the sculpt room"

Then it is subdivided + color map but is missing all details

Details I expect here:

image.thumb.png.ca3c7ea9d758726da508edb06d193779.png

and details I get in sculpt room:

image.thumb.png.28888b0ac60394c29826bcd905b2c83e.png

OK sry I am noticed that my displacement Maps I bake are really Bad but found an different 3DC Thread with the displacement topic.

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53 minutes ago, Carlosan said:

Sorry but, 2. imported Albedo + Normal Map

Normals are ok or inverted ? Try Import > FlipG channel

Hi the normals are ok. I only expected normal maps to be baked as details in the highpoly, which seems to only be the case with displacement maps. But I haven't managed to generate a displacement map that transfers these details well.


My goal is to find a workflow for quick posing outside of 3DCoat. What I want is to create a highpoly, then make it lowpoly via autopology, bake maps, then rig it via mixamo, pose it and import the posed mesh back to 3DC and use the maps to bring the details back to the highpoly. With this I want to iterate the final pose for 3D printing faster.

Hope that make sense

Edited by Daffyd
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3DCoat-2021-92 
Thu Jan 20 21:16:56 2022 +0200

- Hotkeys are now local in different room. You may assign same key for different actions in different rooms. For example, same key for transform in sculpt and transform in retopo.

 

This is one of the happiest news I've been using 3D Coat :D

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12 hours ago, Daffyd said:

Hi the normals are ok. I only expected normal maps to be baked as details in the highpoly, which seems to only be the case with displacement maps. But I haven't managed to generate a displacement map that transfers these details well.


My goal is to find a workflow for quick posing outside of 3DCoat. What I want is to create a highpoly, then make it lowpoly via autopology, bake maps, then rig it via mixamo, pose it and import the posed mesh back to 3DC and use the maps to bring the details back to the highpoly. With this I want to iterate the final pose for 3D printing faster.

Hope that make sense

Converting Normals->displacement is a challenging task. I know how to recover, it is used in materials, you may pick normal and get displacement, but it is much more difficult for uv-mapped models. I think there is no software that can do this. Some day I will implement it, but now it is not done.

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3 hours ago, Yousung said:
3DCoat-2021-92 
Thu Jan 20 21:16:56 2022 +0200

- Hotkeys are now local in different room. You may assign same key for different actions in different rooms. For example, same key for transform in sculpt and transform in retopo.

 

This is one of the happiest news I've been using 3D Coat :D

Yeaay! That is indeed fantastic. :good: 

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31 minutes ago, Andrew Shpagin said:

Converting Normals->displacement is a challenging task. I know how to recover, it is used in materials, you may pick normal and get displacement, but it is much more difficult for uv-mapped models. I think there is no software that can do this. Some day I will implement it, but now it is not done.

thank you very much for the clarification.

Here is a workaround : in addition to importing your model and textures, go to the textures menu > import > displacement map > (import your diffuse there)
this will be taken into account when subdividing into sculpt room.

Yes I know it is not the same as recovering normal map data, but at least it is something. diffuse is sometimes used that way for 3d-Scans to create a little bump. It is "fake", but it works.

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Hi.

-In Voxel Mode-

The Copy Clay Tool changes the model to Surface Mode after leaving the tool. This not good because I work on a large voxel Model, and I often convert by accident. 

there is a workaround, you can switch to an empty layer, before you exit the Copy ClayTool. Then the 'big' model stays in Vox Mode.

I find the tool very useful for cloning small parts of scanned patterns. I like to work in Vox Mode so the surface cant get screwed.

Thank you!

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Incompatibility of the assignment of a hot key for the =same= function for different tools.

The same function "Align to view" seems to be written differently.

When I assign a hot key for the Align to view function (for example) in the Transform tool, the same hot key is removed for the same Align to view in curve transformation mode, for example.

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On 1/21/2022 at 9:03 AM, Ctc_nick said:

Hi.

-In Voxel Mode-

The Copy Clay Tool changes the model to Surface Mode after leaving the tool. This not good because I work on a large voxel Model, and I often convert by accident. 

there is a workaround, you can switch to an empty layer, before you exit the Copy ClayTool. Then the 'big' model stays in Vox Mode.

I find the tool very useful for cloning small parts of scanned patterns. I like to work in Vox Mode so the surface cant get screwed.

Thank you!

Sorry.. again about copy clay. I can't figure out, sometimes the copied parts are not merged to the surface, they stay patches above the surface. At that point the mesh is not repairable. This happens in voxel and surface mode.  The depth settings for this tool are also behaving a bit strange. and Flip doesn't work. 

--------------------

edit: I found out that creating an alpha brush from .obj is much more stable and faster for copying high frequeny details.

Edited by Ctc_nick
got wiser.
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On 1/17/2022 at 5:42 AM, Daffyd said:

so many great things in the release notes but still marked as Beta. When can we expect a new "stable" version? I use Coat in a  company and we don't allow to use of Beta versions. 

It would be very helpful for all bug reporters to check if they have already been fixed. It is our priority to have a stable version -if you look at the changelog the amount of bug fixing is outstanding- but we need to fix even more. ;)

- As Andrew saw: 
It was really hard work to get it with your awesome help.
Iam very thankful to everyone who spent the time testing and proposing.

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Can we get a hotkey manager Andrew?  A central place to review all available hotkeyable options and current keybindings.

Nvil has the best setup I've ever seen.  The way you  handle camera navigation controls is on the right track IMO.  I'd be happy to go over what I'm talking about with you.  But in general, NVIL is powerful because it allows you make complex functionalities by doing things like using any key as a pseudo modifier key along with LMB, MMB, RMB to make unique tool combinations.  They call it streamline tools.  They also have customizable pie menus.

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3 hours ago, gbball said:

Can we get a hotkey manager Andrew?  A central place to review all available hotkeyable options and current keybindings.

Nvil has the best setup I've ever seen.  The way you  handle camera navigation controls is on the right track IMO.  I'd be happy to go over what I'm talking about with you.  But in general, NVIL is powerful because it allows you make complex functionalities by doing things like using any key as a pseudo modifier key along with LMB, MMB, RMB to make unique tool combinations.  They call it streamline tools.  They also have customizable pie menus.

Yes. Basicly a list where you can find which key is already in use.

My dream would be an Input configurator like in flight simulators. You could bind Keys, Mouse, Joystick Buttons, Axis, any kind of hid devices and every fancy combination between. 

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Haikalle, had made some modifications to the Points and Faces tool in the retopo room a while back that was indicative of what would be possible with an advanced hotkeying system.  It'd be nice if you could give the community to the tools to set things up in ways like this to really optimize workflows.  

 

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Thank you for all the hard work guys. 3D coat really amazing from the time im using it for sculpting and stuff.  I wanted to make 3Dcoat my all modeling sculpting app but i cant right now. this is what the modeling room is missing for me to use it as such:

before everything, please fix all the bugs in all the tools. there are still not a few.



--------------------
0. Select with no Select tool (forgot to add this)
A. no matter if you use rectangle to select or brush, when you press hotkey for points/edges/polygons it should just allow you to select right away. and going to a select tool for that is an unnecessary click. and it makes the experience not fluid 

--------------------------

Tools behavior - design them so fast modelers can use.
--

1. Rectangle Lasso should behave as a selection tool not as modeling tool:

A. should always work if you drag it in the background no matter what tool you are using right now (if a transform tool is active and user drag it outside the model, so it drag a rectangle not move things)

B. should have the option to have it as default 

C. with the exception of knife tool or a tool that need the background

D. with select/transform tool it does happen, BUT, if you go to another tool then there is no more rectangle selection. you need to pick it, and that is not good. user should always have the rectangle selection when pressing the background

E. keep ctrl+D for deselect, but Add behavior that if a user press in the background it will deselect everything like in most modeling apps. 

F. Add the option in preferences, that pressing on the rectangle  lasso tool will cancel any tool currently selected

--


--
2.More intuitive free moving / free rotate / scale tool 

A. have pivot like maya when you press a hotkey, and then press on anything else, and the gizmo axis will snap to that point / edge / polygon AND inherit its normal direction into the axis. 

B. Be able to do the pivot with snap.

C. Expose the options to set the axis to global/ local /gimbal /normal direction. so we can add a hotkey to that. 

C1(forgot). Expose the options to set the position of the axis to selection center/ bounding box /else. so we can add a hotkey to that. and in the preferences add the options for the user to decide if he/she wants to have the axis automatically jump to the center of a new selection. 

D. free rotate - make the visual circle axis around the entire thing, not on the tips. will be easier to grab.

E. Free moving / scaling - should have visual indicator to use 2 AXIS without the user switching to a orthographic view and use the center. 
--


--
3. Add basic Modeling brushes

A. Relax brush - relaxes the vertices without changing the surface too much like in maya

B Smooth brush - Smooth the vertices 

C - Move brush - like in the sculpt room. with an option to move the things by their normal direction

D. keep the existing relax tool, but change it to real time representation with an apply button. for less distractive use that does not need ctrl + Z 
--


--
4. Add snap like in other modeling application

A. you have a hotkey to snap the mouse curses with any tool u are using right now to:
- verticies of current mesh or other
- 3d / 2d grid
- bounding box center 
- edges
- polygons 
- pivots 
--



--
5. Fix the symmetry tool. 

A. Improve it to never lose a perfect symmetry unless the use change the model while its turned off. 

B make it work with ANY thing you throw at it as long you are in symmetry mode and not logically do things that are impossible like touching the mid point 
--



--
6. Add soft selection (maya) / proportional modeling (blender)

A. look how they implemented it in maya and blender. both are great. 
--


--
7. Convert select path into shortcut

A. Look at blender's solution, you click at one point, and then CTRL + click another point, and its working.  you don't need to pick a tool just for that. 
But you can keep the tool, i guess some people want to have it. 
--



8. Push split rings even better

A. Add the option like in maya "Insert edge with flow".  that a new ring till respect the curvature. so if you add it to an arc, it till move to match itself to the angle after it is created (look how it works in maya)

B, add the option to create more then 1 with even spaces between them. blender's solution is to move the mouse wheel while the tool is active. its really good by my opinion. 
--


--
9. None destructive subdivide
A. Add the option to turn on and off subdivision like in all other modeling apps. and keep the current option of course, when a user want to commit to it

--

Thank you for reading, and thank you for all the hard work and listening to the community.  


 

Edited by Just a user
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Hey Andrew. Still experiencing symmetry errors in Autopo in Version .93. Steps: Male base mesh in new scene from start voxel menu. Auto with 10000 polys in wizard and bypass density and strokes enabled. Along symmetry axis there are hidden polys in head and torso. Z fighting occurs in problem areas. Using windows 11.

Autopo_Result.png

Autopo_AfterSmoothing.png

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In case it is relevant, the issue is not present in Linux .71.

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Minor errors I am witnessing. Last Draw Point does not work in Retopo room whether using the brush or mark seams tool and others. Also I am seeing a discrepancy in the retopo room with UV island orientation and complex texture in viewport. Side note: pending new udpates for linux, still crashing when baking per pixel. Using Linux.

Revsed_UV_Texture.png

Reversed_UV_Texture_2.png

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Is it possible to get a faster server for the Linux version downloads of the application here in the states? I am looking at an hour to download 800 mb.

Edited by ebitz
grammar
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8 hours ago, Just a user said:

Thank you for all the hard work guys. 3D coat really amazing from the time im using it for sculpting and stuff.  I wanted to make 3Dcoat my all modeling sculpting app but i cant right now. this is what the modeling room is missing for me to use it as such:

before everything, please fix all the bugs in all the tools. there are still not a few.



--------------------
0. Select with no Select tool (forgot to add this)
A. no matter if you use rectangle to select or brush, when you press hotkey for points/edges/polygons it should just allow you to select right away. and going to a select tool for that is an unnecessary click. and it makes the experience not fluid 

--------------------------

Tools behavior - design them so fast modelers can use.
--

1. Rectangle Lasso should behave as a selection tool not as modeling tool:

A. should always work if you drag it in the background no matter what tool you are using right now (if a transform tool is active and user drag it outside the model, so it drag a rectangle not move things)

B. should have the option to have it as default 

C. with the exception of knife tool or a tool that need the background

D. with select/transform tool it does happen, BUT, if you go to another tool then there is no more rectangle selection. you need to pick it, and that is not good. user should always have the rectangle selection when pressing the background

E. keep ctrl+D for deselect, but Add behavior that if a user press in the background it will deselect everything like in most modeling apps. 

F. Add the option in preferences, that pressing on the rectangle  lasso tool will cancel any tool currently selected

--


--
2.More intuitive free moving / free rotate / scale tool 

A. have pivot like maya when you press a hotkey, and then press on anything else, and the gizmo axis will snap to that point / edge / polygon AND inherit its normal direction into the axis. 

B. Be able to do the pivot with snap.

C. Expose the options to set the axis to global/ local /gimbal /normal direction. so we can add a hotkey to that. 

C1(forgot). Expose the options to set the position of the axis to selection center/ bounding box /else. so we can add a hotkey to that. and in the preferences add the options for the user to decide if he/she wants to have the axis automatically jump to the center of a new selection. 

D. free rotate - make the visual circle axis around the entire thing, not on the tips. will be easier to grab.

E. Free moving / scaling - should have visual indicator to use 2 AXIS without the user switching to a orthographic view and use the center. 
--


--
3. Add basic Modeling brushes

A. Relax brush - relaxes the vertices without changing the surface too much like in maya

B Smooth brush - Smooth the vertices 

C - Move brush - like in the sculpt room. with an option to move the things by their normal direction

D. keep the existing relax tool, but change it to real time representation with an apply button. for less distractive use that does not need ctrl + Z 
--


--
4. Add snap like in other modeling application

A. you have a hotkey to snap the mouse curses with any tool u are using right now to:
- verticies of current mesh or other
- 3d / 2d grid
- bounding box center 
- edges
- polygons 
- pivots 
--



--
5. Fix the symmetry tool. 

A. Improve it to never lose a perfect symmetry unless the use change the model while its turned off. 

B make it work with ANY thing you throw at it as long you are in symmetry mode and not logically do things that are impossible like touching the mid point 
--



--
6. Add soft selection (maya) / proportional modeling (blender)

A. look how they implemented it in maya and blender. both are great. 
--


--
7. Convert select path into shortcut

A. Look at blender's solution, you click at one point, and then CTRL + click another point, and its working.  you don't need to pick a tool just for that. 
But you can keep the tool, i guess some people want to have it. 
--



8. Push split rings even better

A. Add the option like in maya "Insert edge with flow".  that a new ring till respect the curvature. so if you add it to an arc, it till move to match itself to the angle after it is created (look how it works in maya)

B, add the option to create more then 1 with even spaces between them. blender's solution is to move the mouse wheel while the tool is active. its really good by my opinion. 
--


--
9. None destructive subdivide
A. Add the option to turn on and off subdivision like in all other modeling apps. and keep the current option of course, when a user want to commit to it

--

Thank you for reading, and thank you for all the hard work and listening to the community.  


 

I agree with everything on this list.  Unnecessary clicks are a workflow killer.  Also real-time previews are always welcome!  Even better, non-destructive workflows.  Soft selection and transformation space/pivot location controls are absolute musts.  A lot of these things have been mentioned before by many people.  Some are likely more complex than others, but overall these are important quality of life improvements that will make other areas of 3DCoat as enjoyable to use as the sculpting and the painting.

I'd also add repeat last action to the list.

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If you do 'Reset setting' in version 93 - 94
It seems the default hotkeys are broken.
- You cannot open Quick Access by pressing the Space key.
- Works differently from hotkeys assigned by default.
ex) If you press '4', the Wireframe view is activated. [w] is assigned, but it does not work.

 


Edit 1)
- The lasso in E-panel got "relaxation" parameter for more accurate contours. In addition, the cut edge become perfectly smooth with the lasso.

And where can I set this?...
It is not visible in the E-Panel.

Edited by Yousung
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On 1/22/2022 at 5:10 PM, Just a user said:

before everything, please fix all the bugs in all the tools. there are still not a few.

Many thanks for your work!
We will have several meetings on this issue.
Not everything is clear yet, but there is already something to think about.
Of course, we will take into account the wishes of users of the Maya program.
Creative success and best wishes from our team.

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  • Carlosan changed the title to 3DCoat 2022 development thread

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